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PostPosted: May 28, 2016, 2:18 am 
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Joined: May 22, 2016, 11:47 pm
Posts: 8
Hey everyone....a aussie with questions for the bike engine build guys.


Recently acquired a honda S600 (600cc 4 cyl , RWD) with ideas of a replacement engine from a much newer bike.
The car sits as a bare clean shell on the chassis with drivetrain and engine inside.

What I was wondering is would it be possible to use the standard gearbox and drivetrain via some sort of adapter to a similar size (physically) motor ? The gearbox is a 4 speed that runs to 11000rpm and reverse. It tops out at 160km/h but could be changed with a different FD.
IF it could work how would this alter the power delivery of say a performance bike motor ?

IF it helps anyone the standard engine is about 19 inches long and 23 inches wide (all connected bits) for comparison to something else...R1 or similar.

Many thanks Ben


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PostPosted: May 28, 2016, 12:40 pm 
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Joined: April 12, 2010, 5:40 pm
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Location: san francisco bay area
Here's a good read (And it's for sale!) http://www.locostusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=14452
Does your MOT require a reverse gear?
To me it looks like the hardest part of it is matching the narrow track of the car with stronger components to handle the increased load.

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PostPosted: May 28, 2016, 12:41 pm 
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Joined: April 19, 2016, 1:03 pm
Posts: 52
Location: Falls Church, VA
love BECs

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PostPosted: May 28, 2016, 6:29 pm 
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Joined: December 4, 2011, 6:19 pm
Posts: 711
About 40 years ago there was a guy living down the street from my parents' house that stuffed a V8 into an S600. Don't remember what the engine was but it was plenty quick when he was done, two stages past a Sunbeam Tiger in performance!! Also, a friend of mine that lived a little further down the street but on the same block (there were interesting people living on that street!) put an Envoy Epic motor into an S600. In both cases they changed the complete drivetrain, replacing the original transmission and getting rid of the S600 drive chain system.

I still remember the sound of the original S600 engine though....it sounded like an F1 race was happening right in front of you even though the car was hardly moving.

Good luck with your engine swap. Be sure to post here so that we can watch!

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PostPosted: May 29, 2016, 9:50 am 
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Joined: October 10, 2010, 10:26 am
Posts: 1117
Location: Bakersfield, CA
bennjamin wrote:
Hey everyone....a aussie with questions for the bike engine build guys.


Recently acquired a honda S600 (600cc 4 cyl , RWD) with ideas of a replacement engine from a much newer bike.
The car sits as a bare clean shell on the chassis with drivetrain and engine inside.

What I was wondering is would it be possible to use the standard gearbox and drivetrain via some sort of adapter to a similar size (physically) motor ? The gearbox is a 4 speed that runs to 11000rpm and reverse. It tops out at 160km/h but could be changed with a different FD.
IF it could work how would this alter the power delivery of say a performance bike motor ?

IF it helps anyone the standard engine is about 19 inches long and 23 inches wide (all connected bits) for comparison to something else...R1 or similar.

Many thanks Ben


Hey Ben- I've just built an N600 BEC, and for awhile ran a T5 tranny inline (gave me overdrive and reverse).. this offered me 30 forward gears (and 6 in reverse!) and I could choose to shift via the bike's box OR the T5.. In the short time I had this setup, I found that the bike motor (VFR800) did much better performance wise if I shifted through the bike's tranny, as the T5 ratios were too broad, and the T5 first gear was so low it was useless.. the T5 was "ok," but in hindsight it was not worth the effort to include, and it was really nice to take that weight out of the car).. I ended up removing the T5 and it's 70+ lbs and just linking directly from the bike motor to the rear diff (you'll likely find you need your diff ratio somewhere around 3.0 as a happy medium for the car/ top end).. As already stated, I think your 600 has a funky chain drive pseudo-IRS.. you'll likely want to yank that (you're way past keeping it stock anyway, right :wink: ), and work in a different rear end of your choice..

Based on my experience I'll offer this too: Using a Guibo (rubber donut) is virtually mandatory for a street driven BEC- it will eliminate the BANG!!! shifting, and it will also get rid of that weird driveline oscillation effect that you're likely to encounter in a BEC at cruising speed.. I had mine setup without one for a time, and it was unpleasant for both me and the bike's transmission.. retro fitted a BMW sourced Guibo inline, and I've been happy ever since.. Also, if you must have reverse, just pony up now and get a FNR box (about $1200-$1500 US) and design it into your driveline..

Your S600 is a very cool little car, soon to be made much cooler with modern HP.. Please keep us posted on your progress, and include lots of pictures (we love pictures :D )


--ccrunner

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My '72 Honda N600 build log (bike engine in a microcar)...
http://www.locostusa.com/forums/viewtop ... 36&t=14452

My '63 Volvo 1800 with a turbo inline 4 build log (LNF Ecotec compliments a Svelte Swede)
http://locostusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=16309

My '59 Berkeley SE492 / Honda VFR800 transplant build: "A Berkeley With Bite!"


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PostPosted: May 31, 2016, 8:01 am 
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Joined: May 22, 2016, 11:47 pm
Posts: 8
Thanks for the replies - Ive studied the pages of this forum hard and in a day have summarized my build , if not pulled it closer to fruition.
Keeping it in the family , the motor will be a CBR1000 or similar , running direct to a propshaft and back to a diff. There will be an electric reverse running off a sprocket around the propshaft. Ill remove the rear end drivetrain entirely and aiming for IRS off the diff too. The beauty is the cbr donk is similar size and layout engine wise but the combo of the gb too is far smaller than the original honda 600cc unit !
One thing that will not change is the original scope with body and chassis. I should be able to pull off this build without touching the body or chassis. Hopefully. 8)


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PostPosted: June 2, 2016, 11:47 pm 
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Joined: May 22, 2016, 11:47 pm
Posts: 8
small update. Learning some more and more all the time - not to mention shutting down some dreams as well !

The standard S600 weighs about 1400 pounds. I am aiming to to reduce weight through accessory reduction , front and rear drum to discs - and use of fibreglass panels. Of note , my intended engine (CBR1000) weighs in about 165 pounds - a considerable weight saving over the standard 600cc donk and gearbox. Looking at a alloy prop shaft too.
I am trying to maintain the existing diff and chain drives if I can - although likely will just swap out for a simple live axle with the standard coil over shocks in the rear.

Since it's to be a road registered car I need reverse - a starter mounted off a sprocket on the prop shaft joint end is the aim. I can't redo or modify the chassis with tube due to registration so will just drop it clean up and reuse.
Hoping for under 1300 pounds or so !


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PostPosted: August 19, 2016, 6:23 pm 
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Joined: May 22, 2016, 11:47 pm
Posts: 8
Hey team - just an update -

I have pulled the plug on the bike engine idea. The car will be car engine powered and essentially a S600 body on a mx5 rear end.

I will update / add questions to other more relevant threads in here - so I bid you farewell !
8)


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PostPosted: August 24, 2016, 9:00 pm 
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Joined: December 4, 2010, 1:53 pm
Posts: 57
Location: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Hi Ben
Any updates?
Do you have the coupe or the convertible?
Back in the day, one of my brothers came home with an S600, and it was idling at 4 or 5000 rpm. I adjusted it for him immediately. It had a redline of 9000 rpm if I recall. He made the mistake of scaring the heck out of his girlfriend in it, and she refused to get in it anymore. He sold it to a buddy who installed a Datsun powertrain, and bought a 59 Pontiac four door sedan.

This was the late sixties, and I recall racing a guy with a 327 powered S600 with my 289 v8 powered 1956 Austin Healey.
cheers
Doug

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