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Learning how to build Lotus Seven replicas...together!
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PostPosted: May 6, 2010, 11:22 pm 
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Joined: November 25, 2009, 8:47 am
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Location: Tecumseh, Ontario Canada
Jack you must be a mind reader. I've been poring over Rod's (cs3tcr) 11 build log for a few days and trying to figure out how closely a Locost chassis and an 11 correspond. I'd like to go with modern powerplant and running gear (I'm doing a Zetec/T5/XR4 based Haynes build running 205/50/15ish tires which) looks pretty tough under a traditional 11 body, but your widened platform looks tailor made.

How different do you see the chassis looking? Would a Haynes style or 442 chassis adapt well or would a completely new layout be the way to go?

Cheers, Ted


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PostPosted: May 7, 2010, 12:18 am 
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Hi Ted -- Portland, actually,*

I'm making the body to fit Book, Haynes Roadster, and McSorley chassis, plus I anticipate making another chassis that's wider in the footwells for folks who strictly want to go with a full body and don't want to be able to change it back to a Se7en some day.

The narrow foot space is a hassle, and there's no reason not to widen it there by a foot if it's going to be covered by body.

*In his next post, Ted was going to ask me where I was born, so I figured I'd answer him in advance.

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PostPosted: May 7, 2010, 6:07 am 
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Location: snow city - it's wet!
A Lola MK1 link for the curious:
Image

I love the look, but unfortunately in the era of modern engines with overhead cams it's almost impossible to find a fun engine short enough to fit under that slinky body.

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PostPosted: May 7, 2010, 9:25 am 
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Joined: February 23, 2009, 3:22 pm
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Location: Frozen Tundra of Minnesota
Welcome back Jack!!!

Once again, my condolences for your loss. It sure is good to see you back on the forum again!

Very interesting new body for MAX. It will be interesting to watch this develop. I’m also interested in how your mileage and performance is changed as a result of the new body design.

As for my “MAX” like project, it will wear the clothing of its original ancestors with a lower speed British touring the countryside look. :wink:

All the best to you and yours!

Take care!

Bill

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PostPosted: May 7, 2010, 9:25 am 
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erioshi wrote:
I love the look, but unfortunately in the era of modern engines with overhead cams it's almost impossible to find a fun engine short enough to fit under that slinky body.

True, though there's the Subaru flat-four.

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PostPosted: May 7, 2010, 9:37 am 
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KB58 wrote:
erioshi wrote:
I love the look, but unfortunately in the era of modern engines with overhead cams it's almost impossible to find a fun engine short enough to fit under that slinky body.

True, though there's the Subaru flat-four.


One could take the "Knobby Lister" approach, as in the LC470 Roadster...
Attachment:
LC470.jpg
LC470.jpg [ 213.63 KiB | Viewed 2580 times ]


It uses a Corvette V8, IIRC. There's enough room on the back of that big hood bulge to mount all the instruments and clean up the dashboard!!!

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PostPosted: May 7, 2010, 11:21 am 
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erioshi wrote:
A Lola MK1 link for the curious:
Image

I love the look, but unfortunately in the era of modern engines with overhead cams it's almost impossible to find a fun engine short enough to fit under that slinky body.


That is a wicked looking little car.

For an inline motor, bulge that mimics the shape of the outer halves of the front fenders might be kinda cool. Maybe somebody on here with decent photoshop skills can doctor this pic to have 3 fender bulges on the front end.


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PostPosted: May 7, 2010, 11:28 am 
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GonzoRacer wrote:
KB58 wrote:
erioshi wrote:
I love the look, but unfortunately in the era of modern engines with overhead cams it's almost impossible to find a fun engine short enough to fit under that slinky body.

True, though there's the Subaru flat-four.


One could take the "Knobby Lister" approach, as in the LC470 Roadster...
Attachment:
LC470.jpg


It uses a Corvette V8, IIRC. There's enough room on the back of that big hood bulge to mount all the instruments and clean up the dashboard!!!


remember the hood mounted gauges of decades ago? :thmbsup:

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PostPosted: May 8, 2010, 10:29 am 
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erioshi wrote:
I love the look, but unfortunately in the era of modern engines with overhead cams it's almost impossible to find a fun engine short enough to fit under that slinky body.

True enough. Also, Locost seating is about as low as I want to go for both comfort and visibility. My solution comes in three parts, each of which reduces the slink factor a bit:

--For wheel travel and steering lock reasons, the fenders are going to be a bit higher off the wheels than the are on the Lola...and the center section will be raised along with the fenders.

--It will have hood bulges as needed. If I put a body into production it'll have different center sections for different powerplants (though I'll probably stop at the Miata-sized version...I can't say I cared for the look of big V8s crammed where bangers went before).

And last but not least...

--I'm tilting the nose a bit; it's higher in the back than in the front. The scuttle and pontoons will blend it in nicely and it'll still look period correct--Lotus had a sports racer with a droop nose and the front pontoons tapered to fit, I forget which model and I'd love a reminder if anybody recalls it.

So the finished product will be pretty compromised for the street (and modern engines) but I'll like it anyway. :-)

BTW, if my Kubota were normally aspirated, it would fit in the Lola, but the turbocharger demands a speed bump in the hood.

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PostPosted: May 8, 2010, 11:22 am 
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erioshi wrote:
I love the look, but unfortunately in the era of modern engines with overhead cams it's almost impossible to find a fun engine short enough to fit under that slinky body.

Some bike engines are pretty short, the R1 sitting in my garage is only ~21" (w/o the airbox).

Moti

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PostPosted: May 9, 2010, 7:09 am 
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Blackbird wrote:
Some bike engines are pretty short, the R1 sitting in my garage is only ~21" (w/o the airbox).

Moti

That's exactly the engine I was thinking of, lol. I figured ~24" of height for mine with a bit of breathing room. Probably about 21" if I went dry sump. That would still require at least a noticeable hood bulge unless you really bump up the size of the wheels. I keep thinking of wheels in 13" to 15" range with tires just under 23" tall.

<wild OT>
Hmm .. perhaps we need to figure out DIY pneumatic or hydraulic valve actuation. That would drop the head height by a few inches, get rid of the weight of the cam shafts & cam gears and also allow user defined "cam profiles" .. completely adjustable for any combination of TPS (or sensor only since the TB butterfly(s) probably just became redundant), load (MAF voltage) and RPM. Just imagine a nice 3D map that could give you any valve timing profile you wanted for any given MAF voltage, RPM & TPS combo... :twisted:
</ wild OT>

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PostPosted: May 9, 2010, 1:24 pm 
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i vaguely remember an electrically operated valve setup by a "home-based engineer" that was supposed to be capable of 10k rpm. in car and driver maybe? it was in one of those type magazines and had the inventor and his system installed on a straight six.(the system was installed that is not the inventor) came out not long before fords experimental "ball valve" system. .. maybe 1990 or so. neither one went anywhere unfortunately. i've been wondering lately about using an injector signal as an rpm sensitive signal to run a hydraulic vvt but thats a different subject entirely.

nasty weather out here today.........

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PostPosted: May 9, 2010, 3:13 pm 
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F1 cars run pneumatic valvetrain and they artificially limit the revs to 18k, in previous years they ran the engines to 19K.

Moti

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PostPosted: May 9, 2010, 6:24 pm 
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Quote:
in previous years they ran the engines to 19K.


Actually the Cosworth V8's were hitting 22k, before the FIA pulled them back. That was the good ole days when engine development was continuous.
I miss those days!
Sniff, sniff.

Here is one turning 20k:

And my personal fav on youtube:


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PostPosted: May 12, 2010, 12:43 am 
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Location: Vancouver, BC
Jack,
Looks like a great project/idea. I cant wait to see the final product.

As for the Lotus with the tapered pontoons, if its not an Eleven or 15 i'm stumped. Once the 17 rolled around the pontoons went straight like the Lola's.

Cheers,
Rod


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