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PostPosted: December 5, 2007, 10:27 pm 
I've not been able to find hard line in the US other than in the 6' maximum pre-flared lengths at the auto parts store. I know Canadian Tire will sell it off a roll, I miss that...


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PostPosted: December 5, 2007, 11:33 pm 
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Keith Tanner wrote:
I've not been able to find hard line in the US other than in the 6' maximum pre-flared lengths at the auto parts store. I know Canadian Tire will sell it off a roll, I miss that...


Canadian Tire in Grand Junction?

I got mine from Gregg Distributors here in Edm. Our company has an account there so I got a decent discount off the street price.

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PostPosted: December 6, 2007, 1:16 am 
I'm from Ottawa. The problem is, indeed, that there is no Canadian Tire in Grand Junction.


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PostPosted: December 6, 2007, 10:34 pm 
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Joined: July 11, 2007, 10:27 pm
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Location: Vail, AZ
For aluminum and steel tubing, flex lines and AN fittings go here:



http://www.aircraftspruce.com/


They cater to the light plane and homebuilt crowd. You can get decent prices on sheet aluminum, plastics, steel, tools, adhesives, you name it.

As for the single flare/double flare question, some of our aircraft have single flare aluminum tubing in hydraulic systems over 1000 psi. Just have to have a good flare.

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PostPosted: December 6, 2007, 11:37 pm 
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Urmm... anyone check AutoZone, or Advance Auto? I know Autozone has 25" coils of steel line for 16 bucks or so. I have 3/16 for my brake lines, and haven't bought the 5/16 for my fuel line yet, but will soon.

They aren't that great about the fittings, at least not AutoZone, but I have a local car parts/hotrod shop, the kind that still have 2 counters covered with catalogues, and they have most fittings I need.

Nate


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PostPosted: December 15, 2007, 1:19 pm 
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Why the need for two filters? Why not just one full-duty filter between the tank and pump?

Nate
SteyrTMP


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PostPosted: December 15, 2007, 1:39 pm 
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SteyrTMP wrote:
Why the need for two filters? Why not just one full-duty filter between the tank and pump?

Nate
SteyrTMP

Because I have foam in my tank and others have had trouble with the foam particles clogging their expensive OEM filters. The cheap solution is to install an easily accessible, low cost filter before the pump.

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PostPosted: December 15, 2007, 1:59 pm 
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Yeah, I have one of the foam-filled tanks too. What I mean is, why two filters? Why not run a cheap filter the first time around, to catch the foam particles, and then change over to a better filter after the first or second test run? Why use two, and is there a reason to have one in front of the pump, and one behind it other than that? Why have a filter between pump and regulator?


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PostPosted: December 15, 2007, 2:52 pm 
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The pump does wear. There is nothing to keep the particles from passing through the regulator and clogging the injectors, which have small, fine intake screens. Without one oxygen sensor per cylinder, the computer won't know if your lean on one cylinder or not.

If a particle got through the screen and caused the injector to stick open, repeated starting attempts can cause a cylinder to fill with fuel, and cause a hydraulic lock, which would ruin the piston and rod, among other things.

A oem system has two filters. The first filter (usually called the "sock") is the pickup in the tank. The most effective position for a filter is right next to what it is protecting, versus a long line inbetween. Many cars place the filter within a couple feet of the rail.

Similarly, the most effective place for a fuse is right next to the power source, versus having a long cable to the fuse that is unfused.

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PostPosted: December 22, 2007, 2:12 am 
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Keith, what brand pump do you have? I'm in the same boat; I went to Summit the other day, and was going to get everything for my fuel delivery setup, and had to tell the girl I might come back another day, as it was going to cost over 300-350 for the entire setup.

I think Summit's worst problem is that they are mainly aimed at the domestic/muscle scene, not stuff like our cars, which tend to be hybrids between muscle and import/rice.

I intend on using hard line from the pump to the engine bay pump, although depending on the pump I use there (dunno if I still have the Miata filter), I might have to adapt from steel to rubber right before that pump, but I want to use large (1/2?) rubber hosing from the tank to the pre-filter, and then rubber hosing from there to the pump. There shouldn't be more than 12-24" max of rubber hosing, but the problem is finding the correct filters and pump. The only glass filter they had at Summit that was meant for a mechanical pump/carb, and wasn't meant for higher pressure.


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PostPosted: December 22, 2007, 9:25 am 
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This thing is $94 and supports EFI systems up to 500hp. I think I read Kieth used a Pierburg pump. Those things are OEM on German imports so they must be good.

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PostPosted: December 22, 2007, 12:11 pm 
Yes, I have a Pierburg. It's the same one that Flyin' Miata sells and has been supplying with some turbo kits for over a decade. They're indestructible - sure, they're a bit more expensive than the in-tank ones, but they never fail. If you want to go junkyard hunting, look at Audis. I'm not sure where the model I used came from, but for some reason the Audi Coupe comes to mind. Westfield uses basically the same pump for high-pressure work.


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PostPosted: February 8, 2008, 3:34 am 
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Ok. So here's where I'm at now. I have the Jax fuel tank, from Jack/Kinetic Vehicles, and just ordered a Walbro GSL-392 & 400-939 kit--the 255lph pump with 5/16" barb fittings.

I plan on using this:

http://www.partsamerica.com/ProductDeta ... Code=4026B

as my pre-pump filter, and I still need a good filter for the fuel rail end. I don't have the stock Miata filter. Will it be able to handle 255lph? Will the fuel rail regulator, for that matter?

Now I am going to need a 90-degree elbow going from 8AN to 3/8 or 5/16 barb, some rubber hose from the tank to the pre-filter, more rubber hosing from the pre-filter to the pump, and then I'm a little confused. The pump has barb at both ends, so I think what I'll want is a small length of rubber hose, and then a 5/16 barb to hard line adaptor, with hard line going through the transmission tunnel. Once it comes out in the engine bay, I will need another hard line to barb adaptor, some hose from the adaptor to the main filter, whatever that may be, and then finally, from the filter to the rail. I then will have to do the return line, using rubber hose from the rail to the transmission tunnel, a barb to hard line adaptor, another at the end of the tunnel, and then rubber hose to the second 5/16 barb to 8AN adaptor.

Where am I going to find these? I've looked everywhere, mainly Jegs and Summit, and most of these aren't there. Any ideas?


What's this?

http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/stores/s ... howValue=1

Is that 8AN to 8AN hose, or is that 3/8?

Also: is there any reason why I can't use the second sump 8AN fitting for my return line, or does the return line have to enter from the top? I figure at worst, I could add some sort of residual valve...


Attachments:
File comment: Red dots show where I figure I would need custom fittings. The rail should (riiiight) have factory fittings. Haven't looked yet.
fuel.jpg
fuel.jpg [ 33.29 KiB | Viewed 6714 times ]
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PostPosted: February 8, 2008, 9:17 am 
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Use the miata filter up front.

The second link is a AN fitting for pushloc hose, not regular efi fuel line.

The oem pump has excess capacity. Universal replacement pumps have as much or more capacity than the oem pump because they are the same part number used for larger more powerful engines. That’s why it has a return line. With your high volume pump, if your mixture doesn’t go rich on it’s own at low rpm, then the regulator and return can handle it.

The glass pre-filter should work well enough. The only way to know is with pressure testing. While a oem intank filter has greater surface area, the opening into the oem pump is about the same area as the opening on a 3/8” hose.

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PostPosted: February 8, 2008, 10:47 am 
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I don't see the need for a hose barb to hard line adapter. In stock form the miata's hard lines just have a double flare on the end and the hose is pushed over that and clamped.

I'm using 5/16 Aluminum hard line. (from Summit) It's much easier to bend and flare.

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