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 Post subject: Re: Ford F-250 overhaul
PostPosted: June 20, 2017, 12:10 pm 
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Location: worcester county, Massachsetts
turbo_bird wrote:
The cams run direct in the aluminum heads, no bearing shells, so that's a bit chintzy.


No its not, that's normal for cams running in alloy cylinder heads. Motorcycle engines have been designed that way since the 1970s. The aluminum makes an excellent bearing surface for the cams to run in.

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 Post subject: Re: Ford F-250 overhaul
PostPosted: June 20, 2017, 4:50 pm 
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Location: Kamloops, BC, Canada
robbovius wrote:
turbo_bird wrote:
The cams run direct in the aluminum heads, no bearing shells, so that's a bit chintzy.


No its not, that's normal for cams running in alloy cylinder heads. Motorcycle engines have been designed that way since the 1970s. The aluminum makes an excellent bearing surface for the cams to run in.

It may be common, but I'd still rather see replaceable bearings so that if there's any damage you can replace a bearing instead of a head.
Kristian

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 Post subject: Re: Ford F-250 overhaul
PostPosted: July 10, 2017, 4:48 pm 
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Talked to the machine shop that's got my block and heads today, he still hasn't touched my stuff in 3 weeks. He says tomorrow is the day. We'll see I guess. I also asked him to get a price/order all the rebuild parts for me, seeing how the Amazon seller hasn't got back to me about what's included in the kits they list for $1000. It's going to cost more getting stuff from the local guy, but it'll be brand name parts of known quality and I shouldn't have any cross border headaches. I've also got to fix some rust on this truck. There's lots of areas on the lower rockers that have the galvanising worn off from gravel spray and have surface rust now. I was thinking about either areosol rust converter (basically phosphoric acid) or POR-15. I'm not sure if POR-15 is available in Canada though. Has anyone used both and can compare results?
Kristian

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 Post subject: Re: Ford F-250 overhaul
PostPosted: July 10, 2017, 5:09 pm 
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Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia
I've bought POR-15 in Canada from Stright-MacKay in Pictou NS, but there must be a source in BC.

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 Post subject: Re: Ford F-250 overhaul
PostPosted: July 10, 2017, 7:54 pm 
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Well I googled it, and Canadian Tire carries POR-15, but not the prep stuff. Maybe I'll try the phosphoric acid based rust converter first, then POR-15. I'll put some rocker guard rubberized stuff on to hopefully stop the gravel from destroying the surface again. I've also been reading about some stuff called Ospho on a hotrodders site that is fairly highly recommended. We're heading to town tomorrow, so I'll see what I can find.
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 Post subject: Re: Ford F-250 overhaul
PostPosted: July 10, 2017, 11:12 pm 
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Location: Holden, Alberta, Canada
Kristian

This is the Por-15 I get from Canadian tire to prep my frames.


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File comment: Por-15 metal prep
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 Post subject: Re: Ford F-250 overhaul
PostPosted: July 11, 2017, 1:39 am 
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horchoha wrote:
Kristian

This is the Por-15 I get from Canadian tire to prep my frames.

Well I'll have to see if they have that too then. I did t find it on their website, but that doesn't mean a whole lot. Thanks guys.
Kristian

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 Post subject: Re: Ford F-250 overhaul
PostPosted: July 11, 2017, 9:05 am 
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If you can snag some of the metal prep, do so. Phosphoric acid is an excellent paint prep, but offers very little rust protection. Metal prep is a zinc phosphate, which adds rust protection.

Great stuff.

Bill


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 Post subject: Re: Ford F-250 overhaul
PostPosted: August 4, 2017, 12:15 pm 
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turbo_bird wrote:
horchoha wrote:
Kristian

This is the Por-15 I get from Canadian tire to prep my frames.

Well I'll have to see if they have that too then. I did t find it on their website, but that doesn't mean a whole lot. Thanks guys.
Kristian


Pretty sure I bought mine from CT.

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 Post subject: Re: Ford F-250 overhaul
PostPosted: September 2, 2017, 1:28 pm 
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Location: Kamloops, BC, Canada
I haven't really done anything to my truck lately, but I did finally get the block and heads back from the machine shop yesterday, plus a box of shiny new parts to put it all together. $260 to bore and hone the block, $750 to go through the heads and reassemble the valves, and $1700 for all the parts. Once the government got their cut, it came out to $3100, so a lot cheaper than Ford would charge to put in a reman of questionable quality from an unknown outside rebuild shop. It would be about $10k to have Ford do it all for me. I still have a few more things to buy though, the dipstick tube was stuck in the block and broke off while I was trying to get it out, and I'm replacing the exhaust manifold studs and the O2 sensors. Rock auto has all the O2 sensors for $120, but it looks like I might have to go to the dealer for the studs and dipstick tube.
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 Post subject: Re: Ford F-250 overhaul
PostPosted: September 7, 2017, 10:41 am 
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I was in KMS Tools yesterday looking for some other stuff, and they had Por 15 on sale, so I got 2 quarts and a gallon of the metal prep. Holy crap that stuff is expensive, came to $169, even with the paint being 25% off. Hopefully it works as good as everyone says it does, I've never used it. I never did look for it at Canadian Tire, I usually try to avoid going to town altogether.
Kristian

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 Post subject: Re: Ford F-250 overhaul
PostPosted: September 10, 2017, 11:35 pm 
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I like when things line up like this. Bolted the bracket from my engine stand on, and everything was just the right height to slide it into the stand.
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Got the block all cleaned up and painted the external surfaces with some leftover engine paint.
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All the important stuff all cleaned up.
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New bearings and dropped the crank in. Tap the dowels in between the block and main caps, then torque up the mains first, crossbolts after. All the bolts in the engine use at least a couple torque steps, first with a torque wrench, then a specified angle after that. Crank spins real nice and smooth. Ford says to use engine oil for assembly line, so I guess that's what I'll use.
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Dropped the pistons in after checking the clearances, man these new engines are built tight. Ford specs are 0.00075" - 0.0015" piston clearance. I was concerned that it was too tight, so I asked my dad to bring over some better measuring tools than my cheap digital calipers. A couple holes are almost too tight, but he figured I'm good to go. I didn't even need a trip to the hospital for stitches this time.
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The rod bolts are the same torqueing procedure, so I finished them up before dinner and bagged the shortblock to keep dust out. The rods are a powder metal type, with cracked caps, so they have to go back together the same as they came apart.
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Kids are in school again tomorrow, so I should hopefully get the heads on and maybe get it timed too. If it isn't too hot out, I'll try the POR-15 on the rust spots too.
Kristian

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 Post subject: Re: Ford F-250 overhaul
PostPosted: September 11, 2017, 7:37 pm 
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Took apart the new oil pump to check for any debris in it before bolting it on. Had to do a bit of reading to see which pressure relief spring I should use though, Melling supplied a 60 psi and an 80 psi. Looks like the 80 psi is the one to use with engines that have the variable cam timing, so that's what I used in mine.
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I cleaned the head and block surfaces with brake clean and bolted the heads on. I hope it all seals up ok, the machine shop didn't touch the block surface. The Ford manual says to put it all together dry and not to use any abrasives on the sealing surfaces, so we shall see.
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Got the cams and crank all lined up, and got the timing chains on. It was pretty easy, even without the special Ford tools to position the crank and hold the cams. You're supposed to use a special valve spring compressor and put the roller followers in after the cams and setting the timing, but I just pulled the cam journal caps back off to slip them in and then bolted the caps back on very carefully so I wouldn't bend the cams.
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I've been using my 24" handle, 1/2" drive ratchet for the final torque steps. It's a really fine ratchet so I can line it up good for the angles, and the long handle makes it easy to get to the angle I need with one smooth motion.
Kristian

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 Post subject: Re: Ford F-250 overhaul
PostPosted: September 15, 2017, 12:53 am 
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Location: Kamloops, BC, Canada
I've got my engine mostly buttoned back up now. Had some fun with the crank seals because I'm cheap and didn't buy the special tools from Ford. And the Felpro rear seal is a one piece, where the original was a two piece, and no explanation of it. So I was rooting around in the gasket boxes looking for a part that wasn't there and I didn't need. I found a thermos lid that was the right size to put the front seal in, and the lid from a tub of wheel bearing grease was the right size for the rear seal. Hopefully this is the last time I see the insides of this engine.
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This is a bit better. Still lots of stuff to bolt back on before it goes into he truck again, but at least I won't feel too bad about it sitting in the garage for a couple weeks while I'm at work now. I'll put the spark plugs back in too, and fill the intake ports with rags, but it's mostly sealed up now. I kind of wish I'd soda blasted the timing cover and valve covers though, they didn't come very clean with just solvent, but it's a work truck and they'd be gross again right away anyway.
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I also knocked a bunch of loose paint and rust off the body where it gets blasted by dirt and gravel. Then degreased with lacquer thinner, wet it down with the POR 15 metal prep, and painted with two coats of the POR 15. I hope this stuff is as good as people say it is. The inside lower part of the doors and the lower sills were pretty bad too, and I should probably crawl under the truck to have a look at the bottom of the cab too. I did everything go to the pinch welds, the rest of the bottom can wait until it's I the garage and I'm not crawling on the ground.
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I'm also cleaning up the rust on my headache rack and box rails. I built that when I bought the truck in 2010, and painted it all with some cheap spray bomb rubberized undercoating. It didn't last, but I couldn't believe how much rust there was under the rails. An air hammer with a needle scaler attachment makes quick work of rust on heavy gauge steel though, but I need a bigger compressor for continuous use. I can only run the air hammer for about 10 minutes before the pressure starts getting too low.
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Kristian

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 Post subject: Re: Ford F-250 overhaul
PostPosted: September 30, 2017, 8:55 pm 
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Got home from work and time to work on my truck again. I took advantage of the nice weather Thursday and Friday to finish up my amateur paint work. I roughed up the POR 15 and the existing paint with sandpaper, then taped off the truck and sprayed some rubberized rocker guard on the lower part of the body. It's not supposed to get above about 15 C again for a while, so I was glad to have a couple warmer days to get that done.
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The cooler and wetter weather now will be ok for getting the engine back in, and the kids being in school will help with actually getting things done too. I found a couple cracks in my old exhaust manifolds when I cleaned them up, so I should probably replace them. They didn't leak yet though, and the aftermarket ones ($310, locally available) seem to have nothing good written o line about them. Apparently they crack and warp right away. Genuine ford ones locally are a touch over $900, and in the middle is a set of JBA stainless headers, available on eBay for about $600 delivered. Ford OEM exhaust manifolds from eBay are about the same price as the headers. I'm leaning towards with reusing the original manifolds and deal with them when they start leaking, or the stainless headers. Does anyone have any experience with modern headers on a vehicle that will see a lot of use? The flanges are 3/8" thick, so should seal better than a lot of the older stuff that's famous for leaking. Another issue with the headers is that I'll have to put them on the engine once it's in the truck, because they aren't locally available.
Kristian

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