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Learning how to build Lotus Seven replicas...together!
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:30 am 
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nick47 wrote:
Looks good, Brad. I think the longer you wait to fully weld, the less likely the frame is to move around. Patience is a good thing at this point. It increases your odds of ending up with a straight frame.

The belt sander is excellent. Almost a required tool IMO.

If you're going with IRS, ditch the Z brace. It's only needed to reinforce the Panhard rod pickup on a solid axle. The R-brace is a good idea and would be better if it were on both sides of the engine bay, but a brace on the nearside tends to get in the way of things. You could make a removable one.


Thanks. Yea, I guess I'll wait. Killing me. I hate waiting, and have very little patience. Haha. Probably not the best attitude to have when building a car that will likely take years. It's a test, that's for sure!

Still setting up the belt sander. 0 Time to work on anything this past weekend, oh well. Will be done tonight, and back to building. Yea, I'll think about making the R braces removable... maybe in a way sort of like the suspension pickups, weld some tabs to the frame, bolt in double sheer. I'd rather not put bolts through the main frame itself, so this will work better. Probably will make both R braces removable for ease of working on / removing the motor. The Z brace will be ditched... didn't know it was only for panhard rod pickup bracing.

What nose are people buying that are building +442E frames? I think the E will make the front end too wide for the normal nose, and the +2 will make it just wayyy too tall for the catfish nose (which i VERY much prefer... much more caterham-y.) Don't tell me I need to recall all my fiberglassing skills and create my own......

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Build Log: http://www.BrokeAssSeven.com -- http://locostusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=13293

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 9:43 am 
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Maybe wait on the R brace till you sit your motor on the table in the frame and take a look?

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 9:47 am 
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Good advice. If I hadn't done that, my R tube would've run right through the oil filter.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 9:48 am 
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horizenjob wrote:
Maybe wait on the R brace till you sit your motor on the table in the frame and take a look?


Yes, absolutely. The R brace(s) will be the last to be put in. I need to read up on how people are locating their differentials/engines on the table... I figure I'll put my frame on 1" blocks, and put the oil pan flat against the table, and mark for mounts. The differential I'm not real sure about where it goes, vertically speaking, but I'll figure it out. I know the driveshaft shouldn't be straight to avoid U-joints freezing up, so I'll probably locate the differential about 1-1.5 degrees lower than the engine, and go from there. I *think* the engine should be located slightly to the right side of the bay, but I'll locate the differential and go from there as far as horizontal mounting for the engine (though, the axles look the same length (miata), so the diff could very well be right in the center of the car.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 4:48 pm 
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As far as suspension goes, Is there any reason I see a lot of times people going with square stock for the front lower control arms, and round stock for the uppers? I also notice many using 1x2 rectangle stock for the front of the lower control arm.... is this only for strength in case of some type of collision with a rock or something? -- I only ask because I'm about to order some 1x2 stock to use as mounting points/bars for the rear differential. The mounting bolts are large, and driving them through 1x1 seems dumb.

Now, the actual mounts for the Miata differential are rubber encased, to allow for a little bit of movement, but the PPF mount is solid. Should the front PPF mount on the diff in the seven also be solid, or should there be some sort of rubber bushings used? I'm planning on 'hanging' the differential from the main mounting bar (like it hangs from the rear subframe in the Miata), shooting the bolts up through, and using locking washers/nuts to hold it in place. I just want to make it easier to remove if needed later on.

Any input is appreciated.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 5:17 pm 
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Quote:
I also notice many using 1x2 rectangle stock for the front of the lower control arm.... is this only for strength in case of some type of collision with a rock or something?


It makes for mounting the lower Miata BJ a lot easier. See Kinetic vehicle's website: http://kineticvehicles.com/ControlArms.html

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 8:10 am 
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rx7locost wrote:
Quote:
I also notice many using 1x2 rectangle stock for the front of the lower control arm.... is this only for strength in case of some type of collision with a rock or something?


It makes for mounting the lower Miata BJ a lot easier. See Kinetic vehicle's website: http://kineticvehicles.com/ControlArms.html


Ohhh right. I knew that, I need to take some sort of memory enhancing supplement. HAHA. 27 and forgetting things I've read not a month ago. -- Kinetic's website is actually where I was looking at it when I came up with the question I already knew the answer to. HAHA. -- Oh well, thanks for reminding me!

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Build Log: http://www.BrokeAssSeven.com -- http://locostusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=13293

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 8:21 am 
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We are Slotus!
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Quote:
I need to take some sort of memory enhancing supplement.


I bought some of that gingko-biloboa herbal supplement to improve my memory.
Now, if I could just remember where I put the bottle!!! :ack:

Sadly, that's a true story...

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JD, father of Quinn, Son of a... Build Log
Quinn the Slotus:Ford 302 Powered, Mallock-Inspired, Tube Frame, Hillclimb Special
"Gonzo and friends: Last night must have been quite a night. Camelot moments, mechanical marvels, Rustoleum launches, flying squirrels, fru-fru tea cuppers, V8 envy, Ensure catch cans -- and it wasn't even a full moon." -- SeattleTom


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:16 am 
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GonzoRacer wrote:
Quote:
The guy told me flatbed, then landscape trailer, and showed up with a 6' utility trailer. He also told me he'd have 4 guys to help move it... he was including me, his 80 year old father {SNIP}, and his 7 year old son. Seriously, I can't make this stuff up.


Yo, Brad-
Sounds like a "Team Slotus Moment" to me! Welcome to the club...
Good to hear from ya, frame is looking better and better!
:cheers:
JDK


I bought a grand piano on ebay once and the lady said her brother would be there and he was 6'7" He was there alright, but she didn't tell me his collarbone was broken. That was a memorable single person move.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 6:58 pm 
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GonzoRacer wrote:
Quote:
I need to take some sort of memory enhancing supplement.


I bought some of that gingko-biloboa herbal supplement to improve my memory.
Now, if I could just remember where I put the bottle!!! :ack:

Sadly, that's a true story...


I used some of that memory enhancing supplement ..didnt help my memory..well thats telling a lie it did make it.. harder, longer,
and gave it more staying power :shock: ..was that my memory?.. ORRRR..i forget now :wink:

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:20 am 
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We are Slotus!
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laserracer wrote:
I used some of that memory enhancing supplement ..didnt help my memory..well thats telling a lie it did make it.. harder, longer, and gave it more staying power :shock: ..was that my memory?.. ORRRR..i forget now :wink:


And there we go... STRAIGHT into the gutter... A-GAIN...:rofl:
Dave, TWWTFM says we shouldn't trash other people's build logs like we do mine, because they might wanna talk about building cars or something. :shock: She also said something about "not letting us play together any more" so I guess we better behave...

Brad- Sorry... :oops: We gets carried away sometimes... :oops:

We now return you to your normal programming.
:cheers:
JDK

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JD, father of Quinn, Son of a... Build Log
Quinn the Slotus:Ford 302 Powered, Mallock-Inspired, Tube Frame, Hillclimb Special
"Gonzo and friends: Last night must have been quite a night. Camelot moments, mechanical marvels, Rustoleum launches, flying squirrels, fru-fru tea cuppers, V8 envy, Ensure catch cans -- and it wasn't even a full moon." -- SeattleTom


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:46 am 
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Location: Southern NH
GonzoRacer wrote:
laserracer wrote:
I used some of that memory enhancing supplement ..didnt help my memory..well thats telling a lie it did make it.. harder, longer, and gave it more staying power :shock: ..was that my memory?.. ORRRR..i forget now :wink:


And there we go... STRAIGHT into the gutter... A-GAIN...:rofl:
Dave, TWWTFM says we shouldn't trash other people's build logs like we do mine, because they might wanna talk about building cars or something. :shock: She also said something about "not letting us play together any more" so I guess we better behave...

Brad- Sorry... :oops: We gets carried away sometimes... :oops:

We now return you to your normal programming.
:cheers:
JDK


Bahaha, like I said, any reply is a good reply. It's exciting seeing unread posts in your build log, even if they are about.. enhancing.. whatever you may need enhancing. Haha.

On topic, I was surprised that there was no location noted in the plans for FU1 and FU2. I assumed from the whole-frame layout, that they attached basically where the ends of S/T and E are. Just looking at the frame after the fact, it doesn't look.. right, but then again, I've never seen one of these in real life, ever, so I have no idea. I don't see any other way to do it to make it look.... more.. right, so I'm probably good. Does anyone have measurements of THEIR FU1 and FU2 tubes, from 'front' of the tube to the inside edge of the front assembly? At the top, I have 5.25", at the bottom... well I don't remember, but it's something like 7" (though, I hope it's more like 9.4", as that's the distance from the front of E to the inside edge of the front assembly.. it probably is, I'll check on lunch).

I think why it doesn't look right to me, is typically you see upper and lower control arms being the same length on each side (front to back). Such, that the chassis mounting points are a straight through shot, and one isn't inset a lot further than the other (read: locost UCA, front being set further out from center line than the rear).

Fortunately for me, but unfortunately for the car, I'm off on vacation next week out of state. So, I probably won't be on much if at all.. and the Seven will be sitting pretty in the garage hopefully not getting stolen. I need one of those garage doors that has the tinted windows or no windows at all. Oh, and while I'm at my wishlist garage door, I'd like it insulated, and made sometime within the last 30 years.

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Build Log: http://www.BrokeAssSeven.com -- http://locostusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=13293

This build is already locosting a fortune...


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:51 am 
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Location: New Zealand
BrokeAssSeven wrote:
I also notice many using 1x2 rectangle stock for the front of the lower control arm.... is this only for strength in case of some type of collision with a rock or something? --

Now, the actual mounts for the Miata differential are rubber encased, to allow for a little bit of movement, but the PPF mount is solid. Should the front PPF mount on the diff in the seven also be solid, or should there be some sort of rubber bushings used?


Regarding the 1x2 RHS for the front lower control arms, there are nicer ways to do it. In my opinion it just looks plain horrible and with these cars this part is displayed for all to see and I guess you have to ask yourself the question, does this look right, because if it doesn't look right then it is probably not.

As for the PPF, in the Miata it connects the diff to the gearbox both of which are flexibly mounted. If you mount your diff with the original mounts then you also need flexible mounts on the front of it otherwise something will break. Either all your mounts can flex a bit or all your mounts are solid.

Bruce


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 11:50 am 
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nisseven wrote:
BrokeAssSeven wrote:
I also notice many using 1x2 rectangle stock for the front of the lower control arm.... is this only for strength in case of some type of collision with a rock or something? --

Now, the actual mounts for the Miata differential are rubber encased, to allow for a little bit of movement, but the PPF mount is solid. Should the front PPF mount on the diff in the seven also be solid, or should there be some sort of rubber bushings used?


Regarding the 1x2 RHS for the front lower control arms, there are nicer ways to do it. In my opinion it just looks plain horrible and with these cars this part is displayed for all to see and I guess you have to ask yourself the question, does this look right, because if it doesn't look right then it is probably not.

As for the PPF, in the Miata it connects the diff to the gearbox both of which are flexibly mounted. If you mount your diff with the original mounts then you also need flexible mounts on the front of it otherwise something will break. Either all your mounts can flex a bit or all your mounts are solid.

Bruce


I agree on it looking horrible. I can understand why some do it the way they do, but I might try to find a different way. Who knows, we'll see after all is said and done. Luckily, that much 1x2 isn't THAT expensive, so even if I end up doing it it that way, I'll feel okay about designing something else later down the road.

Yea... rubber mounts on some.. solid on others.. the solid will absolutely break over time. -- I couldn't tell, does the PPF not mount to the actual miata AT ALL? When I unbolted it from the transmission side, everything got all loosey goosey on me, so it seemed like it was attached to the actual frame somehow. I guess it just holding between the two units was enough tension to make it rigid? -- On that note, I still need to get the PPF off the differential. I have a feeling there will be cutting involved, and a PPF heading to the dump.

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Build Log: http://www.BrokeAssSeven.com -- http://locostusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=13293

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2012 6:57 am 
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Here is how I did mine. The lower arm is non adjustable but there is plenty in the top. There is just enough clearance to allow the use of the original MX5 tie rods and ends with no bump steer.
Bruce


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