LocostUSA.com

Learning how to build Lotus Seven replicas...together!
It is currently April 27, 2024, 11:35 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 32 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: okay, now what?
PostPosted: July 14, 2016, 4:26 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: May 27, 2006, 9:46 pm
Posts: 1954
Location: BC, Canada. eh?
A few bits to think about...

I agree with others that the McSorely +2 and +4 chassis designs are probably better than going strictly "by the book". Even though the "book" chassis is a tad larger than the original 7, it's still on the small size for most adult North Americans. I'm a tall, and fairly slim male - I got into an original '60's Lotus 7 once...and had to be lifted out by friends - I couldn't get out on my own, as I was wedged in there. Plus, it was so short in leg room, I couldn't possibly have driven it.

I know most here advocate using a single donor car as your parts source, but after much deliberation, I elected not to do that. Why? Because you are forced into a lot of compromises, trying to make parts fit into a car design completely foreign to the parts' original parameters. Yes, in the long run it IS cheaper...but not necessarily by much. In my case, the cost difference wasn't enough to justify the compromises I'd have to have made.

By choosing to build without a "one donor car", I've been able to collect the absolute best possible fit for parts, from many sources, so as to virtually eliminate the need to compromise on my finished car.

For example, if I'd used, say, a Toyota as a donor, I'd have felt compelled to use the pedal assembly, regardless of its utter incompatibility with the design I wanted. Ergo, compromise, and a lesser product than I desire.

This is not to say that I've bought everything new - far from it! Most of my parts have been sourced from wreckers, online used, garage sales, local used parts sellers, etc., so the overall cost has been very reasonable. In some cases, though, where I had very specific needs, I've bought brand new parts where their application precisely meets my design, and no used wrecker-sourced parts would do.

The aforementioned pedal assembly example is one instance of this. I saved my shekels, and bought a full set of Wilwood floor-mount pedals & master cylinders. Really not particularly expensive, as it turns out, and they meet my design wishes precisely. Plus, they're brand new, and the best available. It's a part where I wanted NO compromise, and that's what I got.

I'm somewhat biased, in that I have a strong desire to stick to the overall look of the original Super 7 Mk. III, as I'm a bit of a traditionalist. Aside from outside dimensions (which are proportionally very similar, but a little larger so it fits me), a description of my car reads exactly like the original 7 Mk. III (Ford 4-cylinder DOHC engine, Weber DCOE carbs, live axle, etc.), and it looks like one, too. While the engine, etc. in my car look original, they are 21st century stuff.

When it comes to the rear suspension, you'll hear a lot about IRS. I looked long & hard at it, and in the end, went with a live axle. I just re-read Des Hammill's book on suspension design & tuning, and it confirms my decision. He basically concludes that while IRS is a laudable goal, in reality there's little gain in a car as light as a Locost, particularly in light of the added weight and complexity (this, referring to cars that are intended for primarily street use with occasional track days; for all-in race cars, IRS is generally preferred although, even then, live axles still work well).

When I started my build, the cost of going IRS was, in these parts, enormous, and sources were rare. Hereabouts, even a totaled Miata cost huge money, and a rear suspension from a wrecker (when you could even find one) went for thousands of dollars.

Conversely, my Mustang II live axle cost me $100, it's foolproof, and it's lighter than most of the IRS setups available to us mere mortals.

Long story short - don't feel obliged to follow a specific path. Consider WHAT you'll be doing with the car (A pure race car? Strictly street use? Fun sports car with occasional track day use?), whether a single-donor will provide the majority of the specific parts you want for your intended final result, and what your budget will be (on the latter, you'll find that this will likely end up...um...a little optimistic!). There are a TON of options available to you, so balance what you really, really want to end up with, tempered by the extent of your budget, and you'll be very, very happy in the end!

Just my $.02 worth...and, welcome to the madness!! :cheers:

_________________
Scratch building, at continental-drift speed, a custom McSoreley-design framed, dual-Weber 45DCOE carburated, Zetec-engined, ridiculously fast money pit.

http://zetec7.webs.com/


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: okay, now what?
PostPosted: July 14, 2016, 7:41 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: August 27, 2005, 1:04 am
Posts: 1414
Location: Kamloops, BC, Canada
A book frame car can definitely be snug, how big are you? As an example, I'm 6'2", and way to close to 300lbs. My car is a book frame, and it's tight. I don't have room for a proper seat, just back and bottom cushions. It's not very comfy for more than about 1/2 hour drives, because I can't change position while driving. Just a few things to think about. If you decide to go bigger than a book frame, the rear axle from the corolla might not be wide enough either, plus the bolt pattern is a bit of an oddball size at 4 on 4.5".
Kristian

_________________
V6 in a book frame build. Now registered.
viewtopic.php?f=35&t=7587
viewtopic.php?f=33&t=18172


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: okay, now what?
PostPosted: July 14, 2016, 8:08 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: August 6, 2008, 9:33 pm
Posts: 70
Location: Republic of Texas CSA
5'9 180lbs. I think I can fit in a book frame.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: okay, now what?
PostPosted: July 14, 2016, 8:25 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: May 27, 2006, 9:46 pm
Posts: 1954
Location: BC, Canada. eh?
Something else to think about with using a book frame - a lot of people have trouble finding seats that will actually fit into one (even my narrow little Miata seats are a very, very tight fit...and my frame is +2" wide...). As it is, I had to rebuild the seats (remove the reclining mechanism, delete the hinges, etc.) so I could shoehorn them in there, and they're still wedged in tight.

That's one of the many issues I though about before starting my build. Short of building my own custom seats, nothing out there was even close (with the exception of some breathtakingly expensive custom racing seats from Europe).

With a McSorely +4" frame, there are some options available (not many, though).

I'm just saying...

_________________
Scratch building, at continental-drift speed, a custom McSoreley-design framed, dual-Weber 45DCOE carburated, Zetec-engined, ridiculously fast money pit.

http://zetec7.webs.com/


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: okay, now what?
PostPosted: July 15, 2016, 3:15 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: August 27, 2005, 1:04 am
Posts: 1414
Location: Kamloops, BC, Canada
rongaudier wrote:
5'9 180lbs. I think I can fit in a book frame.

No problem, I've got 5" and 100 lbs on you and I fit. But like Zetec7 said, there's not much for seats that will fit in the car, so keep that in mind before you start.
Kristian

_________________
V6 in a book frame build. Now registered.
viewtopic.php?f=35&t=7587
viewtopic.php?f=33&t=18172


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: okay, now what?
PostPosted: July 15, 2016, 7:25 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: August 6, 2008, 9:33 pm
Posts: 70
Location: Republic of Texas CSA
turbo_bird wrote:
rongaudier wrote:
5'9 180lbs. I think I can fit in a book frame.

No problem, I've got 5" and 100 lbs on you and I fit. But like Zetec7 said, there's not much for seats that will fit in the car, so keep that in mind before you start.
Kristian

I can make my own seat.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: okay, now what?
PostPosted: July 15, 2016, 11:03 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: July 29, 2006, 9:10 pm
Posts: 3164
Location: Oregon, usually
turbo_bird wrote:
That corolla would be a great donor.
Yep, what Kristian said. Plus if you go nuts some day, you can drop in a 4AGE.
turbo_bird wrote:
The corolla doesn't have rack and pinion steering
...but an older FWD VW rack works great with that setup. We've made two Corolla-based book Locosts (my MAX and Dave's Maxine) at Kinetic, and Dave (LionsPaw on this forum) is a big guy (and I'm bigger than you, in bulk if not in height), and...
rongaudier wrote:
I can make my own seat.
Yep, that's what we did. If you make bench seats (or low-side buckets) they'll fit you fine, and you'll have sufficient wiggle room to be happy.

_________________
Locost builder and adventurer, and founder (but no longer owner) of Kinetic Vehicles


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: okay, now what?
PostPosted: July 15, 2016, 1:25 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: August 6, 2008, 9:33 pm
Posts: 70
Location: Republic of Texas CSA
Thanks, Jack. As you can tell by my join date, I've been lurking here off and on for about 8 years. I originally was thinking v-8 then s-2000, but I finally realized I don't need all that power. I'd rather go for small light and simple which was the original concept for the 7 anyway. I saw my first 7 back in the mid 70's and though it looked like a really cool car. The one I saw also had the top up and side curtains installed, made me wonder how the driver got in and out.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: okay, now what?
PostPosted: July 15, 2016, 3:56 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: July 4, 2006, 5:40 pm
Posts: 1994
Location: Novato, CA
JackMcCornack wrote:
If you make bench seats (or low-side buckets) they'll fit you fine, and you'll have sufficient wiggle room to be happy.

Bench seats in a 7 are awesome. Almost too much room.
Attachment:
puffyseats.jpg


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: okay, now what?
PostPosted: July 15, 2016, 4:46 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: May 27, 2006, 9:46 pm
Posts: 1954
Location: BC, Canada. eh?
^^Those look GOOD!!

_________________
Scratch building, at continental-drift speed, a custom McSoreley-design framed, dual-Weber 45DCOE carburated, Zetec-engined, ridiculously fast money pit.

http://zetec7.webs.com/


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: okay, now what?
PostPosted: July 15, 2016, 5:07 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: August 6, 2008, 9:33 pm
Posts: 70
Location: Republic of Texas CSA
Yep pretty simple to get some foam, plywood and vinyl. A little work with a staple gun and your done.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: okay, now what?
PostPosted: July 16, 2016, 10:05 am 
Offline

Joined: June 18, 2016, 12:39 am
Posts: 121
That seat has some sewing machine work done to it, but it looks fine for a quick run to the supermarket. To get that look with enough foam for a road trip would require a pro upholstery shop.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: okay, now what?
PostPosted: July 16, 2016, 10:38 am 
Offline

Joined: July 16, 2012, 10:07 pm
Posts: 91
Don't forget the square seat cushion life preservers.
In the event of a water landing -well you know


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: okay, now what?
PostPosted: July 16, 2016, 2:44 pm 
Offline

Joined: June 18, 2016, 12:39 am
Posts: 121
If I was gonna attempt an amphicar, this is the forum I'd start with. Need a trans with a PTO though, and none of those are light...


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: okay, now what?
PostPosted: July 16, 2016, 3:07 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: August 27, 2005, 1:04 am
Posts: 1414
Location: Kamloops, BC, Canada
Dave1976 wrote:
If I was gonna attempt an amphicar, this is the forum I'd start with. Need a trans with a PTO though, and none of those are light...

Could use a transmission and transfer case from a 4x4 ranger, that wouldn't be too bad. Chain drive off the front output to your prop shaft and then you could gear your prop independantly from your drive axle. And front dig units are common on rockcrawlers, so you could use one of them to stop the rear tires turning when the prop is engaged. Just a couple ideas to get you started. Lol
Kristian

_________________
V6 in a book frame build. Now registered.
viewtopic.php?f=35&t=7587
viewtopic.php?f=33&t=18172


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 32 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 8 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
POWERED_BY