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Learning how to build Lotus Seven replicas...together!
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PostPosted: May 21, 2018, 9:23 am 
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Out with the old, and in with the, errr, the old ....

Attachment:
engine out and in.jpg
engine out and in.jpg [ 50.92 KiB | Viewed 1240 times ]


Good, now I can check on some real time measurements.

I was surprised to find a Bosch Motronic EFI and not the more common Delphi here. Very happy that the EFI looks very much stand alone too, very liitle in the way of wiring loom for it, which takes all the engine components straight to the computer box, and then back out again into a loom up to the dash/ignition key. All the other vehicle's electrics, fuse boxes etc, are in a seperate loom again.


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PostPosted: May 21, 2018, 12:16 pm 
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I'll take your word for it that there's an engine under that tangle of hoses and wires!

On your brake pedal linkage, do you have room to extend the pedal pivot forward? The angle of the pushrod going into the booster starts about level and goes up; the usual recommendation is to split the difference to minimize the deflection of the booster diaphragm.


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PostPosted: May 21, 2018, 12:41 pm 
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TRX wrote:
I'll take your word for it that there's an engine under that tangle of hoses and wires!


It's mostly the wiring loom draped over the top. I seriously wish all EFI looms were so simple. Underneath is a pretty simple 2.2 pushrod engine (Toyota 4Y commercial engine), it was free so I'm not fussy at the moment. It's not staying, but just get it driveable is the goal at the moment.


TRX wrote:

On your brake pedal linkage,


Thanks for the note, all under control thanks, just 3D at the moment.


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PostPosted: May 25, 2018, 1:15 pm 
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Cheapracer... I know you’re very busy but you were very helpful before so I'd like to ask another question, please.

You may remember I was very taken by your UCA idea of having two separate arms joined by ‘hooking’ the outer-end heim of one onto the outer-end heim of the other. Unfortunately, for my purposes this would result in very wide-spaced inner mounting points because two arms would need to be about 90˚to each other... so I've come up with another version... by joining the two arms together, one above the other, on the bolt on top of the upright/spindle.

Because of the extra height I've included a ‘cover’ (‘brkt’) to provide double-shear support.

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mangpong-g-w.jpg
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Any thoughts about the feasibility of this arrangement...?

Many thanks, Mangpong.


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PostPosted: May 25, 2018, 2:01 pm 
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The motor has tried on !! Congratulations!!!

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PostPosted: May 25, 2018, 3:00 pm 
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MangPong wrote:

Any thoughts about the feasibility of this arrangement...?


It doesn't work, period. If it did we would all be building them that way, well I would be. Think about it carefully, or just put 2 joints on a bolt like that and see what happens.



marafonets wrote:
The motor has tried on !! Congratulations!!!


Not so easy, was unhappy about some aspects of the fitment, and spent the last 3 days revamping in 3D and building an entirely new chassis that doesn't look much different. In fact some won't even notice it's a new one.

Without changing much at all, the bellhousing area now has an extra 3" width without disturbing footwell width, much needed for the damn clutch fork, and the wheelbase is 2" longer as the engine had to be moved 1" further forward. Of course with a tapered chassis, changing the wheelbase by any amount immediately requires a bunch of other changes. The rollbar is also now much easier to feed into the lower chassis rails.

I reduced the upper longerons section slightly for better control arm clearance, and a number of other changes for simplification. The engine/g'box is back in tonight, and now sitting happily in unison with the chassis as it should be, sump shape, bellhousing area, engine mounts, gearbox mounting etc.

.... and all the internal size increases without changing the exterior packaging. Should call it the "Tardis"!


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PostPosted: May 25, 2018, 9:26 pm 
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Hey Cheapracer
Many thanks for the prompt and positive reply. Back to the (virtual) drawing board. lol.

Mangpong.
______________


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PostPosted: May 26, 2018, 5:20 am 
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Bit more lasering, now have some steering column and brake mounts.

Turned out rather simple, and highly adjustable.

This is a new chassis by the way, not that it looks much different, but the differences really count..


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steering hung 2.jpg
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steering hung 1.jpg
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PostPosted: May 26, 2018, 11:12 am 
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I measured the engine mounts and gearbox mount today, reasonably simple affair, just drew them up and will get them cut tomorrow.


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engine mounts chassis 2.jpg
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engine mounts chassis.jpg
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PostPosted: May 27, 2018, 7:53 am 
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Engine mount test laser and fold done with some thin sheet, make the thicker real ones later.

Found one engine mount broken, now I'm going to have to spend money on my free car, oh the horror!

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engine mounts chassis 3.jpg
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Gearbox mount done, always as simple as Toyota ones usually are.

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Brake cylinder front mount and pivot points done.

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The guys at the local fold shop who give me great service.

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fold shop.jpg
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PostPosted: May 27, 2018, 8:53 am 
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> engine mount

It's a temporary engine. Just drill through the mount and run a bolt through.

'60s-'70s Chevy V8 mounts were very similar, and the driver's side mounts would debond quite often. At the time there were no heavy duty options, so after replacing the stupid thing two or three times the usual fix was to run a bolt through. It did increase the NVH slightly, but by that time few people cared...


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PostPosted: May 27, 2018, 8:57 am 
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I must say I'm impressed. Not only does your chassis look strong enough to use as a bridge, it uses a minimal number of tubes, and your folded-joint-bracket system eliminates a tremendous about of tube mitering and fiddly welding.

By contrast, the balsa model of my chassis looks like it was made by spiders enamored of the Maserati Birdcage...


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PostPosted: May 27, 2018, 12:00 pm 
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TRX wrote:
Not only does your chassis look strong enough to use as a bridge,



People need to understand that it ain't heavy (nor is it my brother), as robust as it looks.


TRX wrote:
it uses a minimal number of tubes, and your folded-joint-bracket system eliminates a tremendous about of tube mitering and fiddly welding.



That's the plan Stan, not finished yet either, there's a number of improvements on the theme to be implemented yet. I hope it gives others ideas as well.

I would prefer to do a Robin Hood CNC tube style chassis, but I am shocked at some of the negative responses I have seen over the years to such simple brilliance. Apparently it took them about 1 hour to bend all the required tubes, and a half day to weld them up.

Attachment:
Robin Hood.jpg
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I have done a few tube chassis on the theme but with a hand bender! Heres one of them, note the upper and lower longitudinal tubes run almost 360 degrees in one piece around the car

Attachment:
tube chassis.jpg
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Last edited by cheapracer on May 27, 2018, 1:29 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: May 27, 2018, 1:06 pm 
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cheapracer wrote:
I would prefer to do a Robin Hood CNC tube style chassis, but I am shocked at some of the negative responses I have seen over the years to such simple brilliance.
Attachment:
Robin Hood.jpg


Bleargh. Count me in on the negative responses.

The front half doesn't look too bad, but the rear... there wasn't supposed to be some kind of supplementary sheet metal support structure or something?


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PostPosted: May 27, 2018, 1:28 pm 
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TRX wrote:

Bleargh. Count me in on the negative responses.


You're looking at detail of one frame, I am talking about the overall concept.


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