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PostPosted: October 21, 2011, 10:17 pm 
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Oh Lord, do NOT build on the floor. After a few weeks of that you'll want to die. Use anything, even two sawhorses from Home Depot - anything to get it up to working height.

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PostPosted: October 22, 2011, 6:40 am 
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I spend my days over, under, crawling beneath and all around ovens and kitchen equipment, so where it is in relation to my person matters little to me. I've spent years learning to over come the need to move the object to suit me and simply do what I have to do where it is! One time, I had to fix a stainless dishwasher holding tank.. hanging half in, half out.. head first.. upside down.. with an SCBA on to get a leak fixed! Difficult wasn't even close to describing that one!! We have a lift at work and the guys are forever trying to get me to put things on it to work on them. By the time they go get the forklift, I already have it apart and halfway back together! Lifts are nice.. but there was a time before them!

I'm more interested in whether there is a reason to ONLY build it on a table. Is it going to cause any build issues? Does it make it harder to do this or that? I can't see why building it on the ground would cause problems, after all... flat is flat, but then again I haven't tried to do it yet.

I appreciate the concern for the knees and back, but I like the stretching and twisting... keeps me limber! And on the ground I don't have to worry about falling off the table when I contort to get to that one difficult spot. I'm not opposed to building it for a short term use... I just don't want to build a frame for a 3rd time for silly reasons!!

Cheers,

KS

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PostPosted: October 22, 2011, 7:18 am 
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Flat isn't necessarily level: if you are building on a garage or basement floor, standard practice is to slope the surface to allow drainage, either to the garage door or the drain. You can do it, but be careful, and don't assume that vertical is orthogonal to the floor.

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PostPosted: October 22, 2011, 7:28 am 
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Warren Nethercote wrote:
Flat isn't necessarily level: if you are building on a garage or basement floor, standard practice is to slope the surface to allow drainage, either to the garage door or the drain. You can do it, but be careful, and don't assume that vertical is orthogonal to the floor.
Yeah, Warren, I thought about that one. I would think that as long as I only reference the frame and not the floor for true vertical, I don't think it would effect me much, right? I do need to make sure it only slopes in one direction.. wouldn't do to build a bow into it, huh? No "small particle" cars built here!!

I'm trying to think back and remember if I ever used a plum bob to reference any lines and cannot think of one time. I used string to reference center line of the frame and align the planes of the axles, but I don't think I ever went to the floor for vertical. Can you think of a reference from the floor? Even checking frame dims, I would go from the table and not the floor, just for this reason.

KS

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Never become a pessimist. A pessimist is correct oftener than an optimist, but an optimist has more fun, and neither can stop the march of events.-Robert A. Heinlein


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PostPosted: October 25, 2011, 1:37 pm 
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Ok... I have a plan! Whether it gets followed is another issue entirely!

I'm gonna build a table. Why? Well, for no other reason than I need a place to store stuff out of the way while the frame gets rebuilt. I started trying to clear a space to work and all I kept doing was moving boxes around. I also need a place to store the engine and other car related items.

I'll do the same thing I did with it after I was done building the last time (cut it in half and made benches and they should be much nicer this time around as they won't be all buggered up by the repetitive cutting and welding I was doing before!)

The garage is nice, but has absolutely no storage. Its a square box with a little alcove for the water heater and basic box storage. Lighting and tables should be mandated in current houses! A single bulb light fixture is criminal!

So one of the guys at work has offered his truck, so as soon as i can plan it, I'll be getting the table set-up!

Woot!

KS

P.s. Nope... nothing to do with back, knees or other body parts. I need storage and benches... might as well defray the costs as much as possible!

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Never become a pessimist. A pessimist is correct oftener than an optimist, but an optimist has more fun, and neither can stop the march of events.-Robert A. Heinlein


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PostPosted: October 28, 2011, 4:21 pm 
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Although not directly related to the car at the moment, it will benefit it in the future.

Talk about fun! The remainder of nearly a ton and a half of ovens finally made it home!! I scrapped the one big one for supply money to build the table and the build reboot on the car (almost $400 in scrap stainless!!).

The second one I'm going to turn into a huge powder coating oven. This cavity is nearly 60x30x30. I'm thinking that I should be able to powder coat just about anything I want, short of the frame! There is a nice roll-in cart that will eventually fill in, but for now, I just need to convert it from a gas powered unit to an electric fired unit. I have oven parts galore at my disposal, so it's incredibly simple!

The 3rd one of the bunch is going to be my personal oven. I work with chefs all day long and figured I might as well join em! Even being the smallest one, it's still capable of feeding hundreds of people a day, so I figure it'll be perfectly capable of doing my backyard BBQ celebrations! I got it.. I'll have a Locost GTG here in Winston when it's done. Might even be able to talk one of the chefs in to filling in since I'll obviously be driving around too much to fix lunch!

Here is a pic of the bunch sitting in my friends garage before all the fun. The big ones are nearly 7ft tall to give you some reference of the size of that monster! The big'uns go for about $50k each... the smaller one is nearly $20k. The total price to my door?? $120k? Nope.. not that high... nope still to high.. I got them home for a grand total of $400. I was utterly amazed and couldn't pass up the chance. How you ask?? Our company allows us to buy scrap equipment for scrap metal value.. not just a reduced value. So, anyone looking for a regular old convection oven for a similar project, let me know as I have scrapped dozens of ovens over the last few months and they just never stop coming!!

So once I get this one fired up and running, I'll start to offer low volume, low cost powder coating. I was always dismayed that no one was willing help me PC a single part or if he would, I had to wait months for a load of similar color. I finally have the chance to make it happen for myself and if it turns out OK, will happily offer it to the group and then hopefully beyond that (I work with a bunch of total gear heads that already have plans to PC all kinds of parts!!).

Have a great Friday!!

Cheers!

KS


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Never become a pessimist. A pessimist is correct oftener than an optimist, but an optimist has more fun, and neither can stop the march of events.-Robert A. Heinlein


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PostPosted: October 28, 2011, 8:54 pm 
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You are the MAN!! Thou the shipping may kill it.
JMR

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PostPosted: October 28, 2011, 11:28 pm 
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Kartracer47 wrote:
You are the MAN!! Thou the shipping may kill it.
JMR
You'd be surprised what shipping actually costs when your company sends units all over the country and I get employee discounts!!

I sent a pair of them.. again scrap units (just stuff we can't sell as new).. to my brother in CA.. shipping was only $500 for the both of them all the way across the country!!

Yeah, it's nice to have friends in the shipping dept!

Cheers!

KS

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Never become a pessimist. A pessimist is correct oftener than an optimist, but an optimist has more fun, and neither can stop the march of events.-Robert A. Heinlein


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PostPosted: March 20, 2012, 2:48 pm 
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OK, well after months of debating, putting it off, money woes and various other things that impede builds, I finally broke through the "blocks" and got to making sparks!

I went out on last Saturday afternoon and cleared the space out and started cutting up sticks of steel. It went a lot easier this time around and I was much more confident on my directions. I had planned to build a new frame after my .120 mix-up, I just never thought it would be this way!

So, without a build table, I started laying all my sticks out and after about 2 hours I have the beginnings of a frame. I have to admit that one of my "blocks" was the TIG welding of the thinner wall steel. I'm used to Stainless (and it's ability to absorb heat), so I was very surprised to find that after only a second or two (after over a years break) I found no difficulty with blow throughs. Just like riding a bike, right? The .065 wall welded nicely and the biggest surprise... being able to manipulate the completed frame. You can just pick it up and almost toss it around! I'm going to go HOW fast in this thing??

Over the span of about 2 days total (finished up on this Sat at about 9pm), I now find myself in the garage staring at a slightly modified McSorley +442 frame. I decided to lower the N1/N2 bars in the rear (Little more elbow room) and change how they join the J/H section of the frame. Despite my "unorthodox" build methods, the frame checks square and has a 3/16 of a vertical "warp" which I want to compensate for sag when the motor and other equipment is loaded in.

I can now begin work on the Rorty rear and front suspension section patterning off my previous build (I have the complete front and rear clip still you can see in the pics) keeping "design" time to a min as it was already a rolling chassis. Should make it go together pretty dam fast!

It's incredible to see it come together so quickly, but maybe it's like a trip you've taken before.. the 1st time seems to take sooooooo long, but the 2nd time seems a lot shorter. Maybe the 3rd time, I'll build the WHOLE car in a weekend? Yeah, right!! I am an optimist, not a fool!!

I forgot to take pics the 2nd day (can you say excited?), but there still plenty of work to capture yet. Here's a couple of the first day. No making fun of the garage... still cleaning up after the move (last box is there in the pic) and haven't gotten to build a proper bench yet (rental!). I'm still trying to figure out how to run power to the place.. there are only 2 outlets in the whole garage (one in the shelves and one for the garage opener) and one single screw-in fixture for light in the WHOLE garage!! Can you say NO VISION!!!

Here's to being a builder again!! :cheers:

KS


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Never become a pessimist. A pessimist is correct oftener than an optimist, but an optimist has more fun, and neither can stop the march of events.-Robert A. Heinlein


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PostPosted: March 20, 2012, 3:09 pm 
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Here's to being a builder again!!


And I'll drink to that with anything that'll pour! Good for you, Bot! Glad you're back at it. Keep it up, and keep the pictures coming!

Regards-
JDK

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PostPosted: March 23, 2012, 11:51 am 
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It is amazing just how much easier it is to copy than design. If there weren't things like Boy Scout meetings, girlfriends and the always bothersome need to sleep, I'd probably have this rolling again! Somebody asked at work about when I think it'd be done and I have to wonder if maybe a fall premier would be possible?

I started copying the front clip again last night. Looking at the burn and cut marks on the old frame, it's an odd feeling to cut, fit and tack knowing it'll not need to be redone again (soon anyway).

Oh, and to all those that told me that the .120 was too heavy... YOU WERE RIGHT! It was startling to lift that front clip up to measure it and realize that it weighs more than the entire frame does currently! Sure, there are shocks and braces involved, but DAMN that thick wall stuff is heavy. I'm thinking of dialing back the power on the engine as I am now sure it'll be too much for the weight. Oh, it'll still be on tap.. 8)

So here are a couple of pics to update. Sorry for the blur.. I wasn't fully awake and neither was my camera!

Cheers and Have a great weekend!

KS


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Check out Firearm Finishes & Coating for options to ceramic coat your Locost parts. Hundreds of stock or custom colors including Chrome and Clear Coating options now available! High Temp options for hot bits!! Plastics too!!

Never become a pessimist. A pessimist is correct oftener than an optimist, but an optimist has more fun, and neither can stop the march of events.-Robert A. Heinlein


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PostPosted: March 23, 2012, 1:05 pm 
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Hey Bot-
I didn't tell you so because you started before I got here, but I bet that .120 wall stuff is really, really heavy! I think you'll like working with the thin wall better and it certainly will lighten up that chassis.

If that girlfriend is just too troublesome, you really should try a goat, they're totally "Low Maintenance"... :shock: Fence the back yard, a little hay in the winter, a water bucket, done! :mrgreen:

Only thing is, they can't cook worth a damn... :rofl:

JDK

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JD, father of Quinn, Son of a... Build Log
Quinn the Slotus:Ford 302 Powered, Mallock-Inspired, Tube Frame, Hillclimb Special
"Gonzo and friends: Last night must have been quite a night. Camelot moments, mechanical marvels, Rustoleum launches, flying squirrels, fru-fru tea cuppers, V8 envy, Ensure catch cans -- and it wasn't even a full moon." -- SeattleTom


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PostPosted: March 23, 2012, 1:20 pm 
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GonzoRacer wrote:
If that girlfriend is just too troublesome, you really should try a goat, they're totally "Low Maintenance"... :shock: Fence the back yard, a little hay in the winter, a water bucket, done! :mrgreen:

Only thing is, they can't cook worth a damn... :rofl:
JDK
Well, that might be an option... seeing how I'm the only one that knows how to run the Combi, the cooking is all my responsibility anyhow! :ack:

Cheers!

KS

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Check out Firearm Finishes & Coating for options to ceramic coat your Locost parts. Hundreds of stock or custom colors including Chrome and Clear Coating options now available! High Temp options for hot bits!! Plastics too!!

Never become a pessimist. A pessimist is correct oftener than an optimist, but an optimist has more fun, and neither can stop the march of events.-Robert A. Heinlein


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PostPosted: March 23, 2012, 1:28 pm 
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Yo Bot!
I don't even know what a Combi is, much less whether you could train a goat (or a girlfriend, for that matter) to run one. So, as usual in these situations I put it into Google. I got numerous "hits" for child-seats for cars and strollers and such and then there was this one:
http://www.tbims.org/combi/
Center for Outcome Measurement in Brain Injury

I'm sure that's a totally serious site, about a serious subject... But in the context of a conversation between us, well the possibilities are endless... And tasteless... And probably too true... :rofl:

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"Gonzo and friends: Last night must have been quite a night. Camelot moments, mechanical marvels, Rustoleum launches, flying squirrels, fru-fru tea cuppers, V8 envy, Ensure catch cans -- and it wasn't even a full moon." -- SeattleTom


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PostPosted: March 23, 2012, 1:35 pm 
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GonzoRacer wrote:
Hey Bot-


Only thing is, they can't cook worth a damn... :rofl:

JDK



They might not be able to cook worth a damn, but when you're tired of them they can be cooked to be quite tasty. Just try that with an old girlfriend. :ack:

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