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are you sure you're not off a tooth on the distributor? that's my first thought.

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The B-3 build log: http://www.locostusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=13941 unfortunately, all the pictures were lost in the massive server crash

The beginnings of the Jag Special,
https://www.locostusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=19012
Again, all pictures were lost.

Hey Robb! I'm not gonna bet money on it, but I think it's in there right. However... Well, you know...


JDK

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JD, father of Quinn, Son of a... Build Log
Quinn the Slotus:Ford 302 Powered, Mallock-Inspired, Tube Frame, Hillclimb Special
"Gonzo and friends: Last night must have been quite a night. Camelot moments, mechanical marvels, Rustoleum launches, flying squirrels, fru-fru tea cuppers, V8 envy, Ensure catch cans -- and it wasn't even a full moon." -- SeattleTom

Basics.
TDC is not always to be trusted on the balancer and one tooth can still "Look" right.

Find true TDC, mark the distributor for where it is now, try rotating it until it fires and compare if you can.
Some of the new electronic distributors will not co-operate in this test.

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If I must be a one-man PC free zone, so be it!

Harmonic dampener outer ring can slip on the rubber, causing marks to be off. Verify TDC #1 aligns with dampener mark. Pull #1 plug, rotate crank with ratchet, thumb over plug hole to feel compression as you approach the mark. No pressure, 180 out.

Also make sure the vacuum advance is plugged into ported vacuum on the carb, not full manifold vacuum. It should have no suction at idle. High idle also affects timing advance to a small degree. Feel if dizzy rotor is springing back as you rotate it to ensure the centrifugal system is not hanging up.

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Miata UBJ: ES-2074R('70s maz pickup)
Ford IFS viewtopic.php?f=5&t=13225&p=134742
Simple Spring select viewtopic.php?f=5&t=11815
LxWxHt
360LA 442E: 134.5x46x15
Lotus7:115x39x7.25
Tiger Avon:114x40x13.3-12.6
Champion/Book:114x42x11
Gibbs/Haynes:122x42x14
VoDou:113x44x14
McSorley 442:122x46x14
Collins 241:127x46x12

Richard & MV8-
Howdy! Thanks for the advice. A couple of comments...

Richard, are you talking about "static timing" the engine? I used to do that with my MGB. I will have to research whether the current electronic ignition will allow it. (DuraSpark, Ford stuff)

MV8, I did that "finger on no.1 plug hole" test a couple of times. We're not 180 out, but like Robb and Richard suggest, I might be a tooth (or 5?) off on the distributor. I'm using an aftermarket dampener, which I don't think has the usual rubber insert. If so, it's pretty thin. I'll take another look at it this afternoon.

Right at the moment, the vacuum advance isn't connected to anything. I may not connect it, but if I do, I'll be sure to hook it up to the correct port on the carb. Thanks for that "heads up"... Earl is probably aware of where to connect the advance, but I was not.

I'm planning/hoping to get back at it after work today. I'll let y'all know if I actually fix anything...


JDK

_________________
JD, father of Quinn, Son of a... Build Log
Quinn the Slotus:Ford 302 Powered, Mallock-Inspired, Tube Frame, Hillclimb Special
"Gonzo and friends: Last night must have been quite a night. Camelot moments, mechanical marvels, Rustoleum launches, flying squirrels, fru-fru tea cuppers, V8 envy, Ensure catch cans -- and it wasn't even a full moon." -- SeattleTom

Excessively [HOTTER then normal] exhaust is an indication of late timing.
Another vote for stabbing the distributor and checking TDC.
I was a party to the outer damper ring moving thing; by more then 20*. Much fun
I now put a paint mark between the inner and outer rings, to verify the outer ring position hasn't moved.
DaveW

Oh, and to find the very top TDC, use a plunger gauge stuck into the spark plug hole. Or I've heard people threading a bolt where the plug goes and rotating the engine until it hits that bolt (gently!). The do the same in reverse rotation. The TDC will be halfway between the two.

But you guys know that.....

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***************
Geek49203 aka
Tim Wohlford
Louisville, KY
Hayes front, S10 +2 rear, Lalo body.

I've done that exact test using a "gutted" spark plug with a bolt thru it. Did it on this engine a few weeks (months?) ago.

I have a length of poly tubing that I "borrowed" from some job site a long time ago. It's stiff, but not near solid enough to scar a piston, especially when held loosely by hand. I can hold it in the #1 plug hole as I rotate the engine with a wrench and feel when it gets to TDC.

Good ideas, and good advice*, Tim. Thank you!
*Not bad for a "Liberal Arts" major!


JDK

_________________
JD, father of Quinn, Son of a... Build Log
Quinn the Slotus:Ford 302 Powered, Mallock-Inspired, Tube Frame, Hillclimb Special
"Gonzo and friends: Last night must have been quite a night. Camelot moments, mechanical marvels, Rustoleum launches, flying squirrels, fru-fru tea cuppers, V8 envy, Ensure catch cans -- and it wasn't even a full moon." -- SeattleTom

Pretty much, but as a quick check on your issue of are you off a tooth or not.
Mark where it fires/makes a spark/sends a pulse now, then find TDC and rotate the distributor body until it fires/makes a spark/sends a pulse and check how far apart the marks are.
Some electronic will work this way, some will not, depending on the triggering mechanism.
Be sure to rotate in the correct direction so as to not add any timing chain slack to the issue.

_________________
If I must be a one-man PC free zone, so be it!

After rereading the issue, it may be appropriate to Kill the messenger. Placing more importance on the timing light indication over the way it runs is like placing the cart before the horse. Try using a basic non-digital, no dial back timing light to confirm.

What model timing light are you using?

_________________
Miata UBJ: ES-2074R('70s maz pickup)
Ford IFS viewtopic.php?f=5&t=13225&p=134742
Simple Spring select viewtopic.php?f=5&t=11815
LxWxHt
360LA 442E: 134.5x46x15
Lotus7:115x39x7.25
Tiger Avon:114x40x13.3-12.6
Champion/Book:114x42x11
Gibbs/Haynes:122x42x14
VoDou:113x44x14
McSorley 442:122x46x14
Collins 241:127x46x12

I would never kill the messenger... Might call him bad names or point and laugh...

First thing, though, you are right, there is a rubber insert in my balancer. It's very thin, not like the one in the OEM balancer. I had forgotten it was there until I looked again yesterday.

Timing light is Summit brand name (I don't know who makes them for Summit) and it does have the dial on the back. James has a better one (Mac Tools) that he is supposed to bring home if/when his memory kicks in. It also has the dial on the back for setting the timing. One might have to go to the flea market or an estate sale to get a non-digital light these days!

Onward to last night's tinkering. I'm more perplexed than I was to begin with. I pulled #1 plug and used that length of poly tube I told Tim about, along with a flashlight to peer down into the cylinder and a long handled breaker bar to rotate the engine. I turned it until both valves were closed (valve cover is off) and the piston was at TDC by feel and sight. Rotor was pointing at #1 as it should have been BUT the timing mark was showing 19 degrees advance!

So, perhaps that rubber bit has let go and allowed the outer "rim" of the balancer to rotate... Or maybe it's aliens... Or maybe I do need that guy Lonnie suggested to drive off the evil spirits... #WhoDeHellKnows...

Stay Tuned, Y'all, I'm gonna go beat on it some more later today!

Peace, Love and "Dog-A$$ Slotus"-
JDK

_________________
JD, father of Quinn, Son of a... Build Log
Quinn the Slotus:Ford 302 Powered, Mallock-Inspired, Tube Frame, Hillclimb Special
"Gonzo and friends: Last night must have been quite a night. Camelot moments, mechanical marvels, Rustoleum launches, flying squirrels, fru-fru tea cuppers, V8 envy, Ensure catch cans -- and it wasn't even a full moon." -- SeattleTom

What is this "distributor" you speak of?

Tim "DIS" 49203....

_________________
***************
Geek49203 aka
Tim Wohlford
Louisville, KY
Hayes front, S10 +2 rear, Lalo body.

Use a "Timing tape" to correct your balancer markings.
Cheap and quick.
Then replace the balancer later (Warranty? ) if it has slipped.

_________________
If I must be a one-man PC free zone, so be it!

G'Morning... Where were we??? Oh yeah...

I had a prolonged discussion with Earl about timing marks and such while we were visiting the farm that has an "open house/petting zoo" this time every year. He recalled that we thought the timing marks on that balancer were wonky last time around and that we'd discussed using a "timing tape" like Richard suggested. I sorta remember that, right before the engine blew up... I had ordered a timing tape, still had it in my toolbox.

So, over the weekend, in between taking grand-kids to the farm and discovering they had a Yugoslavian made tractor with Lucas alternator and starter on it (I told the farm hand driving it half-a-dozen Lucas jokes...) and watching Lewis clinch his 5th World Driving Championship, I actually did some work on the Slotus.

First thing was to make one of those piston stop devices Lonnie and I discussed. Took longer than it should have... Doesn't everything???

Then, rolling the engine back-and-forth around TDC on #1, I made marks on the balancer where the stop did its job and stopped the piston.Not trusting myself OR Bubba to do something like this right the first time, I did it again. Came out the same twice... Something about the "Scientific Method" or some such thing...

So then, measuring the arc around the balancer and measuring the mid-point of the chord of the circle and finding a line from center of balancer thru the chord at a right angle (Oh Emm Gee! He's doing geometry!!!) and thru the middle of the arc and I get a new TDC mark.The angle finder is not finding any angles, it was a convenient size, magnetic so it could hold itself in place and a straight edge.

Looks like this when all the measuring and cursing stopped--Note where the Sharpie line crosses the timing marks... 32 F**KING degrees off!?!?!?! Whot th' Bloody 'Ell is up with that???

Speaking of cursing... And Sharpies... I made about three swings from looking on the intake manifold to looking on the table behind me to checking the floor under me to adding a few more Bloody 'Ell's to my tally until I finally stopped in mid-rotation and saw it. Some things never change...

I may repeat this process this evening, just to be certain... If I can find the damn Sharpie. And then I might just apply that tape. (Before you ask, yes, I have found the tape. )

Many thanks to all of y'all that chipped in advice and knowledge. I'm gonna try to live up to it... Stay tuned!


Peace, Love and "Hide-A-Sharpie"
JDK

_________________
JD, father of Quinn, Son of a... Build Log
Quinn the Slotus:Ford 302 Powered, Mallock-Inspired, Tube Frame, Hillclimb Special
"Gonzo and friends: Last night must have been quite a night. Camelot moments, mechanical marvels, Rustoleum launches, flying squirrels, fru-fru tea cuppers, V8 envy, Ensure catch cans -- and it wasn't even a full moon." -- SeattleTom

This is doin' me 'ed in...