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The GRM is THE way to go!! It's cheap too.

You get to park in the infield so no 60+ mile walks, you have food, places to sit, guides, tours, walking in the garages, the ability to talk to all kinds of teams, places to get out of the wind/rain/sleet/hail/cold/hot/etc. Plus they have other fun things to do such as slot car racing, group food excursions . . . well you get the idea.

I wouldn't do the Rolex any other way, now Sebring is just fun all by yourself with no guides or even anyone you know because you'll make all kinds of new & strange friends before the night is over.

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mobilito ergo sum
I drive therefore I am

I can explain it to you,
but I can't understand it for you.

Thanks so much for the nice trip report, JD. It's always better to hear from a person who was there, rather than just rely on the media reporters, although the guys on FS1 and FS2 (former Speed Network guys) are generally pretty good.

I've never been one of those "I love X brand and consequently I hate brand Y" type of guys. I root for all our domestic manufacturers. In the last 10 years or so Corvette Racing has been outstanding and handled every transition to new rules professionally and with success. As far as I l know, they were the first (7 years ago?) to provide in-car cameras and effectively give you a ride-along at Le Mans over the Internet, which I greatly appreciated. I figure it's as close to driving Le Mans as I'll ever get. Now, it's commonly done, of course.

I've been at street level (Long Beach) when the C7.R goes by and when you're 20 feet from them it is a total experience that you can actually feel in your body. And, that's with a dumbed-down engine to meet the FIA rules. You wonder what they'd be like if they could run any Corvette engine, full spec. As to the driving experience, I can only imagine. But this year, Mike Rockenfeller, who usually drives for Porsche or Audi was a co-driver in the #3 Corvette. He said he absolutely loved the car and could hardly wait to get back in it for his next turn. Given what he has driven, and won in, at Le Man and Daytona, that tells you a lot.

But, I think the new Ford GT is the future. Once they get it ironed out, it's going to be hard to beat. It's a huge technological leap too. Plus the silly thing is just so high-tech and sexy. It's totally cool and what will be needed to be competitive with Porsche, Audi, Ferrari and Lamborghini in GT racing. Maybe that why the (officially unconfirmed) C8.R will be mid-engined. All we need now is a new Viper, maybe an Alfa-based chassis version (SMILE)?

Thanks again!

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Damn! That front slip angle is way too large and the Ackerman is just a muddle.

Build Log: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=5886

JD - thanks very much for replying to my questions...it really explains what you can expect if you attend. I don't know what our plans are for next year yet but there's a possibility of attending. If so, I'll definitely let you know.

Carguy - The GRM tip for Rolex 24 sounds like a really good plan. While I've never been to Daytona I've been to Sebring many times to a variety of events and I found it just as you indicated, laid back, full of interesting people and easy to get involved. All of my visits but one to Sebring have ended up with dirty hands for me after being in the right place at the right time and offering help to someone that needed it. Two years in a row I helped with a clutch change on the same Ferrari 333SP...they asked me not come back the next year in case it was my presence that was causing the clutch to go.

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Bill H
Winnipeg, MB, Canada

Bill, Lonnie- You are most welcome... It was a great trip, and I'm happy to talk about it. Wish I'd taken more pictures, well, pictures that looked like something besides blurs of various colors. I kinda sorta got the two Corvettes crossing the finish line... I'll have to download those and see if they're recognizable...

David- I have a question about the GRM thing. It's in the midway area, right? Over where all the big tents were, outside the oval off the backstretch. Can you actually see the track from there?

I saw lots of folks with RVs that set up in the infield, put out their awnings/shade tents and their chairs and grills and such and then hung a flat-screen tv off the side of the RV and watched the race. Seemed to me, I could watch TV at home, why drive all that way and not go actually SEE the cars? To each his own, I guess...

Oh, another note about all the walking. On Saturday, we got there around noon, parking areas were full-ish and we walked from the back lot. Sunday was much better, got a spot near the street, right across from the speedway. AND, there were times within the speedway, as in walking from the west end of the bleachers to the tunnel at NASCAR 4 and on into the infield that we COULD have caught one of the shuttles. We just didn't wait for one.

Any-hoo... That was Bubba and Earl's big adventure at Daytona... No livestock were harmed in the making of this weekend...
And no bail money needed.

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JD, father of Quinn, Son of a... Build Log
Quinn the Slotus:Ford 302 Powered, Mallock-Inspired, Tube Frame, Hillclimb Special
"Gonzo and friends: Last night must have been quite a night. Camelot moments, mechanical marvels, Rustoleum launches, flying squirrels, fru-fru tea cuppers, V8 envy, Ensure catch cans -- and it wasn't even a full moon." -- SeattleTom

The year I went to Sebring with my son it was sparsely attended so it was easy to walk around plus the Pros acted like just plain people. At the start of the race we stood next to one of the top drivers (can't remember which one anymore). He was in street clothes just watching to see how his co-driver was doing. We stood next to one of the Speed Channel guys doing an interview. My son talked to Moretti (Momo) while I talked to Peter Egan. Reminded me of an SCCA national race, only with famous teams and drivers.

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My car viewtopic.php?f=37&t=16434
1930s Style Sports Car viewtopic.php?f=36&t=16888

JD you have better views of the track than the guys in the outside bleachers plus there's plenty of seating. And you get to move from place to place very easily and with fewer steps. Parking in the infield is a HUGE plus.

You can get on top of the big building just downwind of the start finish line (I don't remember what the building is called) and have a killer view of the start & the finish.

Plus with GRM you have intimate contact with any number of drivers and crews. We talked for quite a while with Patrick Dempsey and I even had him call my wife who promptly hung up on him because she was so flustered.

Their midnight tours are legend

_________________
mobilito ergo sum
I drive therefore I am

I can explain it to you,
but I can't understand it for you.

Hey JD, just dropping by to chat 302's... There is a new book on building them coming out end of year or holidays, I think. It's written by David Vizard and there are a couple of threads htat have been going on at speedtalk about it. The state of development on these and the Chevy V8's is at this point is very impressive.

There must be more than 20 different aluminum cylinder heads available for this engine and Dave Vizard speaks of describing how to get 400 ft-lbs of torque out of a 306 with just the AFR 165 heads. Those are the smallest after market heads and work with the stock pistons.

I have an ECU update I'll get to soon, I promise.

Oh, here's mister casual looking a little more everyday in his car that basically won lemans outright 5 years earlier.. Note the bedroll behind the driver. Here's a great description of a journalist riding around in lA in the actual car. It's kept at a Musuem that drives it once a month. It says the police were never able to catch him, imagine putting that down a straight at 180 MPH on those tires. Oh, it was a big bore engine those dual exhausts must have been deafening in town. Scroll down here and there are pictures of Steve working on the car with his mechanic and also Steve driving it on Sunset Blvd.

http://59magazine.nl/art/steve-mc-queen/
http://autoweek.com/article/car-life/retracing-steve-mcqueens-los-angeles-his-jaguar-xkss

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Marcus Barrow - Car9 an open design community supported sports car for home builders!
SketchUp collection for LocostUSA: "Dream it, Build it, Drive it!"
Car9 Roadster information - models, drawings, resources etc.

Hi Marcus-
Yeah, I been readin' up on Ford 302s lately my-own-self. I'm thinking I'm gonna be building one soon, like starting tomorrow... I've got the block from Engine #1 cleaned up and loaded on the truck to go to the machine shop. I'm scouting the interwebz for bargain prices on the rotating assembly of my dreams. E-Bay Motors, anyone???

You can go about .030 over on the bore, typical re-build kind of overbore, nothing fancy, the go with a 3.25 stroke (0.25 more than stock) and you get a 331 cu in displacement without worrying about rod clearance on the bottom of the cylinders and other such craziness. I'm not lacking power or torque, really, so there's no point in goin' crazy with this. It's more a matter of "while you're there, might as well go a leeeetle bit further." Stay tuned, we'll see what happens at the machine shop. I'm hoping I don't have to do anything other than a basic re-build on the block.

AFR seems to be a very popular choice for Ford cylinder heads. For now, I'll probably go back with the stock heads, because they's paid for... But one O' these days, Brother, we'll try out some AFR 165s in aluminum. I think that'd be cool... Lighter and more power... What's not to like?

I've heard of Mr. Vizard, I think he intentionally mis-spells his last name. Should be Wizard. But by the time his book comes out, I'm likely to be building Engine #4 or 5... Still, it would be a great reference to have. Thanks for the tip!

Other'n that, how the heck are ya?

Peace, Love and Overbores-
JDK

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JD, father of Quinn, Son of a... Build Log
Quinn the Slotus:Ford 302 Powered, Mallock-Inspired, Tube Frame, Hillclimb Special
"Gonzo and friends: Last night must have been quite a night. Camelot moments, mechanical marvels, Rustoleum launches, flying squirrels, fru-fru tea cuppers, V8 envy, Ensure catch cans -- and it wasn't even a full moon." -- SeattleTom

Hey, JD, are there any restrictions on what you can do to the engine in your racing class? I realize you don't need a lot of extra power, but how about turbocharging instead of a lot of expensive internal stuff? Just run low pressure (6-8lb) and basically stock engine. Buy a used turbo (or two ) and have the Engineering Department at Slotus Worldwide come up with a low cost turbo rig?

Just another "way too early in morning" thought from the Left Coast. Fell free to ignore it.

Cheers,

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Damn! That front slip angle is way too large and the Ackerman is just a muddle.

Build Log: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=5886

Huh? What did you say? Sorry, I was ignoring you... Not really...

I think Marcus was responding to a PM I sent him the other day which contained info you haven't been privy to. (Although I'm not sure what the privy has to do with it, and we gots indoor plumbin' here at Team Slotus World HQ anyhow!)

There is an on-going problem with the motor currently in the Slotus. It was fouling plugs and smoking, and there were these weird higher-than-possible compression numbers on #2 cylinder when I tested it. Then that last issue kinda went away, but the smoking and plug problem has been somewhat persistent. Intermittent, but persistent. Testing the leakdown was not conclusive, nor was pressure testing the cooling system (to check integrity of the head gaskets, etc). James came to the conclusion there's broken/damaged rings and/or damage to a cylinder wall or walls.

The motor in the Slotus now is put together off a short block James built for a Mustang race car several years ago but didn't install. It sat, wrapped in plastic, in his shop for several years before I got it. We talked about rebuilding the damaged cylinder cheaply as possible, which had a certain appeal ($$$) but then I realized the other 7 cylinders were as old as the one causing the problem. (And, we're not 100% sure it's only one cylinder causing a problem.)

So, rather than patching up that motor, I'm taking the block from the first motor, the one that spun a rod bearing, and building a new engine from there. The 331 stroker kit is mostly a "while you're at it" opportunity to upgrade. The mild stroker kits I've been looking at don't really cost much more than going back with "stock" type 302 parts, so whot-th-'ell, might-as-well!

And that's the rest of the story, as Paul Harvey used to say. I'm a-gonna build my-own-self a new motor. Me and James... And Earl... And (Lord help us) Bubba... Stay tuned!


Peace, Love and Rotating Assemblies-
JDK

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JD, father of Quinn, Son of a... Build Log
Quinn the Slotus:Ford 302 Powered, Mallock-Inspired, Tube Frame, Hillclimb Special
"Gonzo and friends: Last night must have been quite a night. Camelot moments, mechanical marvels, Rustoleum launches, flying squirrels, fru-fru tea cuppers, V8 envy, Ensure catch cans -- and it wasn't even a full moon." -- SeattleTom

I was thinking of pushing the heads and getting a junkyard Exploder motor to put them on. In the two motors you have now, you can't put together a rotating assembly? Going 306->330, gives you a %10 boost from displacement. I'm not sure why Dave Viazrad made his comment in terms of torque or maybe I mis read it, but 400 ft.-lbs. would map to around 400 HP I would think.

You would get less to start at least but that's where the heads could take you. It's more than your T5 is going to want to see. I think it works out on cost if you don't have to do an engine re-build. But you may be plagued by the stuff you have now if you don't re-build so I either way makes sense.

AFR heads would save you 50 lbs. Hmmm, I wonder if, someday, we could talk you into doing a timed run with a 50 lb. bag of sand in your car and get a report on how much difference it makes...

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Marcus Barrow - Car9 an open design community supported sports car for home builders!
SketchUp collection for LocostUSA: "Dream it, Build it, Drive it!"
Car9 Roadster information - models, drawings, resources etc.

Did someone mention AFR 165's? I'll just put this link here and let nature take it's course. They managed to squeeze 400 HP out of the stock short block, including the stock cam, with a set of AFR 165 heads. They also ditched the efi and put a carb on it, plus headers, but an aftermarket efi could make at least as much power once properly tuned.
http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/engine/116 ... e-buildup/
Kristian

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V6 in a book frame build. Now registered.
viewtopic.php?f=35&t=7587
viewtopic.php?f=33&t=18172

did someone mention stock block, turbos, and hot rod magazine?

http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/engine/hrd ... ng-theory/

I'll just let nature take its course



BUT to the topic on hand.. I've seen a bone stock T5 take 450 horse and 400 ft lbs torque in a cobra ish replica.. I think it made it three seasons of road racing, along with a handful of shenanigans before finally going kaput.

My understanding of the T5, is that its not the power that kills them.. its launching them which has earned their poor reputation for power management.

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Tucker

Yep, like you said... I'm sure I could piece together everything to go inside the block, but it would all be "old" stuff. I'm not real confident that the pistons, rods, etc are really in good shape and I know that crank is not. Perhaps the crank in the current motor is good, but I bet the pistons/cylinder walls are not. And so on... Besides, I just wanna build a new motor!

But your point is well taken, Marcus, in that the secret to making HP and torque is in the heads. Good intake flow, good combustion chamber design, good eshaust flow, etc, can make all the difference. And one of these days, I'm a-gonna do just what you're suggesting and put some Al-You-Min-Ee-Um heads on the motor. Not right now, but some day soon.

Kristian, you're on the right track, those AFR heads seem to be really good stuff. That brand could find its way into my engine bay. Hide and watch, Little Brother, hide and watch!

Then I'm gonna listen to Lonnie and go with a supercharger...


JDK

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JD, father of Quinn, Son of a... Build Log
Quinn the Slotus:Ford 302 Powered, Mallock-Inspired, Tube Frame, Hillclimb Special
"Gonzo and friends: Last night must have been quite a night. Camelot moments, mechanical marvels, Rustoleum launches, flying squirrels, fru-fru tea cuppers, V8 envy, Ensure catch cans -- and it wasn't even a full moon." -- SeattleTom

I added the AFR 165s to a 331 engine I had in a Cobra. We had wheelspin issues coming off the corners - it was a Cobra remember and that seems to be condition of life with them.

I wanted to move the power band up a bit so that power didn't come on so abruptly which I hoped would make it easier to modulate the wheelspin out of the corners so I also changed cams.

I'll see if I can find the specs on it, but I remember I went with more lift than duration to keep it tame on the streets. That worked very well. We got a 7,000 rpm redline and tamed the beast. The car was almost fun to drive plus we didn't spend nearly as much time imitating a Tilt-a-Whirl and got way more track time.

_________________
mobilito ergo sum
I drive therefore I am

I can explain it to you,
but I can't understand it for you.