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Learning how to build Lotus Seven replicas...together!
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PostPosted: November 15, 2014, 12:41 pm 
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john hennessy wrote:
i have plenty to do, infact i don't know how i ever found time to go to work!


That's what my retired friends say. At least the ones that didn't kick the bucket. I've gone to three viewings in the last few months, not my favorite thing to do. I'm wishing all of my old friends good health so I can quit going to these things.

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PostPosted: November 15, 2014, 4:23 pm 
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If you go crazy again, you should fly out to Colorado and do the run in Boulder CO from Pearl Street to the top of Longs Peak and back. I haven't done it personally but it is infamous here.

Have you every seen the Mercedes Benz SSK Trossi Roadster?

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PostPosted: November 15, 2014, 5:23 pm 
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The photos just above are very interesting. Are you doing a coupe or a roadster?

Congratulations on the impending retirement. After a year (that's how long it took me before I didn't feel uneasy about not being at work) everything in my life got much better. Like John, I have so much to do now that I don't know how I found time to work. I even get up at 4:30AM to get started early each day. I wouldn't be surprised if your Chronic Fatigue got much better after 6-9 months, maybe 12 months at most.

Best of luck with your build and build log. I'll be subscribing.

Cheers,

Lonnie

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Damn! That front slip angle is way too large and the Ackerman is just a muddle.

Build Log: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=5886


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PostPosted: November 15, 2014, 9:33 pm 
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GonzoRacer wrote:
I'm pretty sure that if God had meant for man to run that far, He wouldn't have given us Henry Ford...


And where would we be without Henry? I remember when I was around 10 riding with my uncle in his restored Model T (or maybe A, I was 10 you know). I thought I knew where all of the controls were supposed to be but his car had the throttle on the wheel like a turn signal. The pedals did all the wrong things and when we came to a steep hill we had to back up it because the fuel was gavity feed and if you went up front first the fuel flow stopped.

esp42089 wrote:
Have you every seen the Mercedes Benz SSK Trossi Roadster?


Yep, you're on the right track.

esp42089 wrote:
If you go crazy again, you should fly out to Colorado and do the run in Boulder CO from Pearl Street to the top of Longs Peak and back.


I'm still crazy, my body just stopped cooperating. I have a long list of ultras I'd like to do if things ever turn around.

Lonnie-S wrote:
Are you doing a coupe or a roadster?


Coupe for sure. I'll go into more details later.

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PostPosted: November 17, 2014, 12:09 pm 
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DESIGN CONSIDERATIONS

Today’s word, OK two words, is design considerations. What important things are we keeping in mind while we design this thing?

ROOF

Ever since I bought my F V back in ’78 I have had at least one open car. Funny thing is I don’t like open cars. Being an Indy and F1 fan when I bought a race car it just had to be open wheel. Just the way it is, never a thought to the contrary. When I bought my first sports car it was an RX7. It was a great car but I felt like some kind of traitor. Real sports cars don’t have roofs. I bought MGs so I could feel better about myself. Also I wanted to be able to tell Joseph Lucas Prince of Darkness jokes. I want a roof and it’s my build so that’s what we are going to do.

ROLLCAGE

I want one. Not because I’m going racing or plan to be on that roof I just put in but because other people don’t pay attention. York isn’t a big city but it is big enough to have bad traffic and many of the people I see are texting, talking, eating or otherwise not watching what they are doing. The problem with Locost rollcages is that they look like they are an afterthought that was just tacked on. It doesn’t matter that some of them are incorporated right into the frame from the beginning they still look bad.

How do we fix that? Build it into the body. The front hoop for instance will go inside the A pillar. Since the body and rollcage will be built together we can avoid the ugliness of production cars with rollcages added later. Hopefully, once the interior goes in the rollcage will be invisible.

WINDSHIELD

I will definitely have one but I’m undecided on what kind. I’m leaning towards the period correct split windshield, but I also like the laid back one piece. Aside from being more aero it will make seeing the stop lights easier. Here is one I saw at the Carlisle Import Show last spring.

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DOORS

Yeah, Jim Morrison was a jerk but I still like the Doors. I also want doors for my car. Not flimsy fiberglass doors but steel doors with roll up windows in them. My hot idea is to use part of the donor car body to get the hinges, door catch and door seal area. Here is the section. I will be trimming most of it away.

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I will also use the donor car doors but cut them down to get rid of the excess width. I will cut to the outside of the blue tape then reskin the door to match the rest of the body.

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WEIGHT

More than my Locost but less than a Miata. Lots of room to play between those two. Most of my choices will be made without worrying about how much the car will weigh.

I’ll continue in another post. I have to find more pictures first.

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PostPosted: November 17, 2014, 2:07 pm 
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OK, I’m back. Here are some more Design Considerations

FRAME

Just about every build log I’ve read, except for the Atoms, uses 1” square tubing. I have a bunch up in the attic. But I’m not going to use it. Well, maybe some here and there but I’m thinking about larger tubing. When I cut up my donor Miata I realized that Mazda carefully hid a ladder frame under the body. It is made of stamped steel box sections welded to the rest of the body and painted to match. I couldn’t find a good picture that illustrates this. The picture below does show the front part of the box section.

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I’m going to use large square tubing to tie the front and rear suspension together. The rollcage will be welded to the square tubing. Rollbar braces will tie into the square tubing at the subframe attachment points. All of this fun stuff will be constructed at the same time as the body so they should play nice together. Things that don’t will be taken off and done again.

BODY

Steel. The main portion of the body will be steel. I plan on doing something like vroom with a body buck but not quite as ambitious. I’ve always wanted to learn how to shape steel so now is the time. The cars of the ‘30s were mostly slab sided so that much will be easy. The hood will be similar to a Locost hood, once again simple. The trunk area will have gentle curves, still not too bad. The roof will be the bear. No, I didn’t forget the fenders. I plan on wimping out of the fenders. The shape I’m looking for is very similar to the ’37 chevy fenders. Fiberglass versions of these are for sale and I can modify if necessary. Here are the fenders.

Pictures here.
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SUSPENSION

General consensus is that Mazda hit a home run with the Miata suspension. That’s good enough for me. Heck, I’ll even take a triple. Since weight is not a consideration why not use the whole Miata suspension as is. Nothing makes my eyes glaze over faster than a highly technical discussion about suspension design. I only look at them in case someone posts pictures of old McLarens or Lolas for reference. Just so happens that I have some complete Miata suspensions right about here…

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FUEL TANK

The one in my Locost sits right out in back. I’ve been rear ended twice, my wife three times and my son once since we’ve lived in York. None caused big damage but we weren’t driving Locosts either. I want to put a store-bought tank behind the seats and between the rear wheels. I’m not keen on repeating the home built tank adventure I had on my Locost and since I should have more space to work in maybe I can buy a tank that fits. By the way, does anyone say “store-bought” anymore? I wore store bought clothes to school but my wife wore mostly home made.

More design stuff later.

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PostPosted: November 17, 2014, 4:30 pm 
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:shock: Run87k, I'm hooked and lurking! Looking forward to any direction this takes; you've already opened up some "real world gremlins" to the L7. I have been fascinated by the Lotus' simplicity, but like you cringe when I think about my texting while driving neighbors. Having driven 3-400,000 miles in Dallas traffic as a service technician, I have seen and been at the mercy of Murphy's traffic trolls! :cheers: Chris :lurking:


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PostPosted: November 17, 2014, 5:55 pm 
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Have you looked at midlana.com for ideas? He took the locost idea and made it a mid engine using Miata uprights. He doesn't use doors on his, but I'm going to use his suspension with a 1 1/2"X3" frame with a 1923 T bucket body with doors. He had a build thread on this site. John


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PostPosted: November 18, 2014, 9:58 am 
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JohnHancock wrote:
Have you looked at midlana.com for ideas? He took the locost idea and made it a mid engine using Miata uprights. He doesn't use doors on his, but I'm going to use his suspension with a 1 1/2"X3" frame with a 1923 T bucket body with doors. He had a build thread on this site. John
Have you looked at midlana.com for ideas? He took the locost idea and made it a mid engine using Miata uprights. He doesn't use doors on his, but I'm going to use his suspension with a 1 1/2"X3" frame with a 1923 T bucket body with doors. He had a build thread on this site. John


Thanks for loooking in John. I've seen his build log here and that would be a good suspension to copy but I'm going to use the complete Miata suspension, subframes and all. The rear subframe has been used on a few builds I've seen, but so far only Exige with his My Tube Frame Miata Subframes build has the only one I've seen using the front. I seem to have forgotten how to copy the link so I can't send you straight there. It is an interesting build because he built it inside a shipping container. Kind of like a ship in a bottle.

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PostPosted: November 18, 2014, 2:02 pm 
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BUILD TABLE

Another thing traditional to build logs is pictures of the build table. A big strong, manly table for doing cutting, welding, hammering and other manly stuff on. OK, here’s mine…

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What??? Where’s the legs? We don’t need no steenkin’ legs! The top of the table is set to the ride height of the bottom of the car. The wheels will sit directly on the floor and when I stand back and admire my creation (or wonder where I went wrong) it will be as it should be on the road. I will make Br… I mean fixtures to fasten all of the important car stuff to the table. Once all of the important things are on the table, the body design will begin.

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PostPosted: November 18, 2014, 3:25 pm 
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Doubles as a small dance floor

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Too much week, not enough weekend.

OOPS I did it again
http://www.locostusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=17496

Blood Sweat and Beers
http://www.locostusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=15216


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PostPosted: November 18, 2014, 3:51 pm 
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I gotta say that if I squint a bit, I can really see how that "Whatthehaye" could be adapted to a more-or-less typical Locost frame. :cheers:

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PostPosted: November 18, 2014, 9:47 pm 
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I'm pretty young still and building a car on the ground sounds like a pain in the back. Do you have a crane to lift it all up if you change your mind?


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PostPosted: November 19, 2014, 9:21 am 
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esp42089 wrote:
I'm pretty young still and building a car on the ground sounds like a pain in the back. Do you have a crane to lift it all up if you change your mind?


I'm kinda old and can confirm that it is a pain in the back and the knees as well. As the build goes along you'll see that this will end up too heavy to be on a table. Also being able to see it sitting at ride height is important to the design process.

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PostPosted: November 19, 2014, 9:35 am 
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Run87k wrote:

I'm kinda old and can confirm that it is a pain in the back and the knees as well.


I concur. All the work on TETANUS, Blood Sweat and Beers, and Patches has been done on or near the ground. A day on my knees in the garage fitting parts or welding floor pans, or whatever has me reaching for the Aleve before I go soak in a hot bath.

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OOPS I did it again
http://www.locostusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=17496

Blood Sweat and Beers
http://www.locostusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=15216


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