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Learning how to build Lotus Seven replicas...together!
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PostPosted: March 15, 2017, 12:45 pm 
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Lonnie, I too used 5/16 line but didn't go to the extreme that seven13bt did. No an fittings, no barb fittings. I simply cut the brake line to length and added a light bubble flare on the end to prevent a loose line from slipping off. I pressed the EFI fuel hose over the bubble flare and clamped it in place. No problems in 6 years.


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fuel line.JPG
fuel line.JPG [ 83.47 KiB | Viewed 2246 times ]

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PostPosted: March 15, 2017, 7:59 pm 
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I've done exactly as Chuck suggests on other EFI vehicles, no issues yet. I did the same on my locost too, but its a low pressure carbureted setup.
Kristian

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PostPosted: March 16, 2017, 8:02 pm 
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@rx7locost
@turbo_bird

OK, thanks Chuck and Kristian for that info. That's nice to have in the back pocket as an option!

Regards,

Lonnie

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Damn! That front slip angle is way too large and the Ackerman is just a muddle.

Build Log: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=5886


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PostPosted: March 25, 2017, 9:59 pm 
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I've been doing lots of figuring and fab'ing, but 90% of it is pretty mundane stuff like brackets, flanges, etc. I am working on routing issues for the wiring bundle that runs to the rear, fuel lines, rear brake line and the (trunk) battery cable. Due to the small size of my tunnel at rear, and the large size of my live rear axle, I'm just not happy with the idea of running everything out the back of the tunnel. It provides too many opportunities for Mr. Murphy to step in unexpectedly if there is a failure of the driveshaft or U-joint at the pinion housing, or if the Panhard rod breaks and I loose lateral control of the axle.

Here's what the end of the tunnel looks like:
Attachment:
File comment: Tunnel, looking from the rear.
DSC03674.JPG
DSC03674.JPG [ 145.08 KiB | Viewed 2173 times ]

The orange electrical cable is my mock-up piece for the battery cable. It's about half the diameter of the actual battery cable, but very flexible, so easy to play with. The battery will be in the boot on the right side of the car. The fuel tank will be slightly offset to the driver's side, but go over the centerline onto the passengers' side also. I have more clearance above the differential pumpkin and the pinion housing than below it.

You can see the notch cut out in the rear crossmember to clear the bottom of the pinion housing. The pinion is offset on my Ford 7.5" axle. The rear U-joint will run in the clear space just ahead of the notched crossmember. The potential vulnerability of the cable is larger than I'd like. The fuel supply line and EFI return lines will run fairly high, emerging on the left side of the tunnel, and running to the left. The wiring bundle will be top most on the drivers side and run over the middle of the chassis. The brake line run is still up in the air, but will probably run at the lower left, protected by the larger gap between the pinion housing notch and the 1" x 1" RHS vertical at the end of the tunnel.

I spent a lot of time today looking for a more satisfactory solution from a safety point of view. I don't have a perfect one, but I like this setup better.
Attachment:
File comment: Setup puncturing the seatback above the seatback horizontal and running over the stiffener at the top of the tunnel. Those two are simulated by the cardboard mock-ups.
DSC03670.JPG
DSC03670.JPG [ 118.06 KiB | Viewed 2173 times ]


The colored circles represent the battery cable (red), wiring bundle (green) and fuel lines (blue) penetrate the bulkheads, represented by the cardboard pieces. This would avoid everything running in an area where a runaway axle could pinch them off or shear them, or an exploding U-joint would be most dangerous.

Of course, if they ran unprotected through the cabin, we'd be going from the frying pan into the fire. So, I came up with this simple way to isolate and seal them off from the cockpit:
Attachment:
File comment: White card piece represents a removable sheet metal piece that would seal off the runs from the cockpit.
DSC03672.JPG
DSC03672.JPG [ 134.92 KiB | Viewed 2173 times ]


It will be behind your shoulder when sitting in either seat, so won't be a problem for driver or passenger. I know I can seal it up tightly, so nor worries about leaking. This should get the runs high up and forward of the pinion U-joint, pinion housing and differential pumpkin. If the drive shaft lets go, there should be some limited protection provided by the tunnel structure itself.

For the brake line, I think I'm going to run it along the undertray in armor until it's behind the transmission mount, then put it along the bottom of the tunnel on the driver's side. Going under the transmission mount means being exposed below the undertray anyway, and going above it make it easy to damage the brake line inadvertently when the engine/transmission are installed. They go in in together in my build and you have to fiddle them about quite a bit to get everything to line up.
Attachment:
File comment: Transmission mount setup.
DSC01407.JPG
DSC01407.JPG [ 138.12 KiB | Viewed 2173 times ]


As I near (about 3 weeks away) a certain, very significant age milestone, I was wondering if my remaining brain cells were sufficient to make an elementary pattern freehand with a compass, ruler, straight edge and Xacto knife. I haven't done one since my Engineering Origami (descriptive geometry) class about 45 years ago. It was pretty simple, but worked out well. I am now reassured. :lol:
Attachment:
File comment: Simple manual pattern.
DSC03669.JPG
DSC03669.JPG [ 135.2 KiB | Viewed 2173 times ]


Cheers.

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Damn! That front slip angle is way too large and the Ackerman is just a muddle.

Build Log: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=5886


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PostPosted: March 28, 2017, 4:41 pm 
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Looking good, Lonnie. I'm envious of your mostly finished welds and painted chassis. Some day :)

Ok, I'm heading back to the garage...

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PostPosted: March 29, 2017, 7:16 am 
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As I near (about 3 weeks away) a certain, very significant age milestone,
:shock: You're finally turning 16 and gonna get your driver's license :?: :?: :?: :mrgreen:

Nice lookin' bit of origami you put together, Sir. Well done! Maybe Moti DO work there! (He still don't work here...) :mrgreen:

:cheers:
JDK

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PostPosted: March 29, 2017, 12:54 pm 
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@seattletom
You're making great progress, Tom. Plus, you're going to get there in V8 style with all kinds of 6-speed shiftin', while I'll be in the slow lane with my humble 1-off. :lol:

@GonzoRacer
16? Oh how I wish! Of course, I'd only want to be 16 again if I had at least half the smarts I have now at <unknown age> so I wouldn't do 95% of the dumb stuff I did last time through. :mrgreen:

Cheers,

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Damn! That front slip angle is way too large and the Ackerman is just a muddle.

Build Log: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=5886


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PostPosted: March 29, 2017, 4:05 pm 
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Doing dumb things and surviving is where all the good campfire stories come from. If you wish you hadn't done 95% of the dumb things you did when you were 16, you must have some good ones. I wish I could still do the dumb stuff I did back then, and I take every chance I get to be a kid again.
Kristian

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PostPosted: March 30, 2017, 4:32 pm 
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turbo_bird wrote:
. . . If you wish you hadn't done 95% of the dumb things you did when you were 16, you must have some good ones. . . . Kristian


I grew up in the 50s and 60s in the San Francisco Bay area. You probably know the cultural menu at that time: beatniks; hippies; drugs; alcohol; rock and roll; sex & free love; etc. The last two are the 5% I'd do all over again, but let's not talk about the others, eh? :wink:

As to your behavior, that orange sports car is a dead give away, Kristian. :mrgreen:

Cheers,

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Damn! That front slip angle is way too large and the Ackerman is just a muddle.

Build Log: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=5886


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PostPosted: March 30, 2017, 11:42 pm 
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You know what they say..
If you remember the 60's you weren't really there
Or was that the 70's? I don't remember.........

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PostPosted: March 31, 2017, 10:19 am 
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As to your behavior, that orange sports car is a dead give away, Kristian.
Get Kristian to tell you about the catapult he built... :twisted: I always knew I liked that boy! :mrgreen:

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JD, father of Quinn, Son of a... Build Log
Quinn the Slotus:Ford 302 Powered, Mallock-Inspired, Tube Frame, Hillclimb Special
"Gonzo and friends: Last night must have been quite a night. Camelot moments, mechanical marvels, Rustoleum launches, flying squirrels, fru-fru tea cuppers, V8 envy, Ensure catch cans -- and it wasn't even a full moon." -- SeattleTom


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PostPosted: April 1, 2017, 4:31 pm 
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GonzoRacer wrote:
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As to your behavior, that orange sports car is a dead give away, Kristian.
Get Kristian to tell you about the catapult he built... :twisted: I always knew I liked that boy! :mrgreen:

Ha, that's lots of fun. My cousin was behind my house and asked what it was for. Just flinging rocks into the bush. We've got it figured out pretty good now, rocks between the size of a baseball and a softball work the best, and I can throw them about 65 yards. There seems to be a distinct lack of those particular rocks in and around my yard now though. Anybody on our side of the dirt road out back is within range, but they better stand still, aiming is a slow process. I made some big snowballs this winter and added water to get the weight up, then put them in the freezer because things were already melting, but my wife took them out before we could try them out. Something about needing freezer space for groceries or something. I'm going to have to tune up the gokart soon too, then build a bigger one for the kids to grow into. I might try it out once or twice, just to make sure it's ok for them. You know, safety first.
Kristian

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PostPosted: April 10, 2017, 7:36 pm 
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This is just a little quickie update. I'm still working back and forth between educating myself on fuel, electrical and brake components, planning/designing/making things, and searching for parts. Like all these tasks, it takes 3 times longer than you'd expect, but I'm just working away at it.

I did have one setback. I ordered 5/16" fuel lines in a 25' raw roll because my Mustang donor had 5/16" hard lines. I'd decided to use AN-style fittings, and 5/16" is a standard -5AN line. However, there is almost nothing made in -5AN size and I spent an exasperating day trying to locate the various fittings and hoses I needed to implement my supply & return line layout.

However, I noticed that if you jump up to 3/8" tubing, all doors are open to you because you go to -6AN hardware and just about everything is available in that size. Luckily, I hadn't cut any material off my 5/16" line roll. I was able to return it, but I'm now waiting for the replacement 3/8" hard line, which won't be here for another 3-4 days. I am now much, much smarter about AN stuff due my misadventure, and that's good. It was a little painful, though. :BH:

So, "upward and onward" tomorrow, eh? I do see a glimmer of light at the end of the tunnel now, but still think it will be the end of the year before I get it ready for its testing and registration.

Cheers,

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Damn! That front slip angle is way too large and the Ackerman is just a muddle.

Build Log: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=5886


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PostPosted: April 11, 2017, 10:02 am 
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Lonnie-S wrote:
This is just a little quickie update.
And, as Rowan and Martin always told us, "Everybody likes a little quickie now and then!"

:cheers:
JDK

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"Gonzo and friends: Last night must have been quite a night. Camelot moments, mechanical marvels, Rustoleum launches, flying squirrels, fru-fru tea cuppers, V8 envy, Ensure catch cans -- and it wasn't even a full moon." -- SeattleTom


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PostPosted: April 17, 2017, 11:29 pm 
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I did get some cardboard templates translated into metal, such as the two infill panels for the transmission tunnel and the middle of the seatback. The cover for the fuel lines, battery cable and wiring bundle is done as well. My replacement 3/8" fuel line tubing came on Saturday. The fuel line AN fittings were ordered last week and they started to arrive today, as did a portion of the brake system order. I'm using Wilwood shorty "master" cylinders: one for the front brakes; and one for the rear brakes. It looks like Summit Racing had Wilwood drop ship part of the brake system order, and that portion of it arrived around noon time today. Only one master cylinder kit was included in that arrival.

The calipers and rotors are from my '94 Mustang donor. Everything else in the brake system will be new, including the pedal box and balance bar. I have the balance bar assembly from Wilwood here now, but need to finalize the pedal box design, then fabricate and install it. I have my brake pedal ratio and all the other brake system parameters determined, but have work left to do on the clutch pedal and accelerator pedal portions of it.

The drivers seat will have a 5-point harness, which I have on hand now. The weld-in plates for the lap belt anchorages are now designed, fab'ed and welded to the lower outboard chassis rails, and the RHS/plate structure of the transmission tunnel on both sides of the car. My camera battery required a recharge and I didn't get photos of those to include here tonight. The shoulder strap mounts will come later as will the anti-submarine strap, which I'll anchor the the seat structure, when built.

I gave my wife the option of a 5-point harness for her side, but she wants an inertia reel system, so she can move around in the seat without unbuckling herself. I saved my inertia reels from the Mustang, but I don't think the shoulder reel will be suitable for the Locost because of the way it mounts to the B-pillar in the Mustang. I'll have to dig the lap reels out of storage and see what I can do with those.

I decided to make the cover for the tunnel infrastructure stuff out of 3003 aluminum, simply because I had a suitable piece on hand. A new, taller cover pattern was required, however. I felt the version 1 pattern made a few days ago didn't provide enough room.
Attachment:
File comment: The new tunnel cover pattern trail fitted to the 14 gauge infill panels now cut and trimmed to suit.
DSC03681.JPG
DSC03681.JPG [ 144.95 KiB | Viewed 1818 times ]

Attachment:
File comment: I used Sharpies to lay out the patter on metal, and center punched the sheet at critical junctions. I cut the pattern out with hand shears.
DSC03682.JPG
DSC03682.JPG [ 152.63 KiB | Viewed 1818 times ]

Attachment:
File comment: The hand-bent cover is pretty decent. I made a mistake in the layout, but it's minor. I'm letting "perfect" go, and going for "good" now in non-critical things, as I really want to get the car finished by year's end.
DSC03683.JPG
DSC03683.JPG [ 136.17 KiB | Viewed 1818 times ]

So, that's it for today. I'll be back in the garage tomorrow, and hopefully the remainder of the parts on order will arrive then.

Cheers,

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Damn! That front slip angle is way too large and the Ackerman is just a muddle.

Build Log: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=5886


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