LocostUSA.com

Learning how to build Lotus Seven replicas...together!
It is currently September 25, 2018, 6:00 am

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 15 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: February 18, 2018, 6:50 am 
Offline
Toyotaphobe
User avatar

Joined: April 5, 2008, 2:25 am
Posts: 4704
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
I'm splitting this off from the Longitudinal transaxle thread because I want to go into more detail about this and not ruin that thread.

I said "Regardless of what you find in the VW/Audi world, making it run outside the donor car is the limiting factor.


Slappynuts said "Easy as pie, I specialize in these engines.If anyone has any questions, go ahead."

"For the drive by wire cars, all you need to do is plug in the engine side of the harness to the ECU, and then hook up the power ground, K line and the 6 wires for the throttle pedal. Its not a big deal at all. That will get it running. Ideally you will need a few more simple things hooked up as well. This is in case you want to save a couple hundred bucks at the expense of an afternoon. "

"No, all the engine sensors are one harness that attaches to the big plug on the ECU (very similar to the ford ecoboost packages). The big plug is all engine sensors and outputs. There is about 10 wires that need to be hooked up from the small plug depending on if you plan to use the cluster or not. The ecu is very similar to this, and this is what the harness will look like. The difference will be that you will still be able to use a VW cluster if you want. "

"I have done a few Nissan engine swaps, and it is very similar. In the case of the VW engine, you will need to add 6 wires for the DBW pedal and code out the immobilzer in the ECU (I do a couple of these a week, so its not a big deal). What you get with this is a wideband ECU with awesome data logging and tuning capabilities. The last car I street tuned with a stock longblock and upgraded turbo made 415whp using E85 on a dynojet. Weeeeeee :-P"

There are so many cool new engines that put out a lot of hp NA but I keep being told you can't use them for swaps because they need to see input from X sensor or Y sensor so you can't use them outside. VW is one of those companies and engine families that I'm told it won't work with and then along comes Slappynuts.

My '04 Honda S2000 engine only requires that I keep the key & sensor package to be able to start and run it. There is also a minor mod you can do to the ecu to eliminate the anti-theft.

I'd looked into the GM & Ford worlds because they sell standalone engine/ecu/wiring packages and found they were mostly V8 or turbo engines.

A little further digging shows that many are using HPTuner to get rid of VATS & the rear O2 sensor (although I'm not sure why you need to get rid of the rear O2 sensor, especially if the car has to be made street legal) and are able to use a variety of GM, Ford & Dodge engines.

HPTuner is pricey and they have some sort of "credits" system to get even more money from you.

The picture below is the Bosch ecu that Slappy posted and shows the engine wiring harness plug in and the chassis plug in. Interestingly the Bosch ecu can't be tuned by HPTuner.

So Slappy we simply don't need to hook up the chassis plug at all to make the VW/Audi engines work?

Does anyone know if GM or Ford would be that simple?

Well I mean as long as you keep the key & sensor someplace intact?

At least on GMs the super high pressure fuel pump for Direct Injection appears to be mounted on the engine. I'm guessing it's just the standard fuel pump to get the gas to the high pressure pump.

Here is an interesting read on a V6 into a Miata and this thread very clearly illustrates why you want to load your pictures directly into the Locost forum and not use a 3rd party system with linking.

http://www.mazdatalkforum.com/viewtopic ... 0efd30af11


Attachments:
ecu.jpg
ecu.jpg [ 18.76 KiB | Viewed 778 times ]

_________________
mobilito ergo sum
I drive therefore I am

I can explain it to you,
but I can't understand it for you.
Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: February 18, 2018, 11:25 am 
Offline

Joined: August 26, 2010, 7:12 pm
Posts: 279
Location: Minneapolis
I guess I am supposed to reply here LOL. As far as the immobilizer goes, there are VW/Audi tuners all over the country(and world) who shut off the immobilizers on these ECUs regularly, and they generally charge $50-$100. I do about one a week.

As far as the wiring goes, there is info all over on how to wire these ECUs to swap the engines into other cars, I have only actually swapped the earlier drive by cable cars, but soon I will write up a how to for these engines. Until then, I will see if I can get some kind of link with the actual info.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: February 18, 2018, 11:27 am 
Offline

Joined: August 26, 2010, 7:12 pm
Posts: 279
Location: Minneapolis
Probably enough info in here. http://clubgti.com/showthread.php?20588 ... nstall-FAQ


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: February 18, 2018, 11:42 am 
Offline

Joined: August 26, 2010, 7:12 pm
Posts: 279
Location: Minneapolis
Here is the pin out for the DBW part. Pretty simple. Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: February 18, 2018, 11:54 am 
Offline

Joined: August 26, 2010, 7:12 pm
Posts: 279
Location: Minneapolis
Here you go, the AWM engine is the best one to use BTW. http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthrea ... infothread


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: February 18, 2018, 3:55 pm 
Offline
Toyotaphobe
User avatar

Joined: April 5, 2008, 2:25 am
Posts: 4704
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
slappynuts wrote:
I guess I am supposed to reply here LOL.


Well you and anyone who has any data on how to use the GM or Ford factory ecus.

I appreciate all your info. Apparently in recent times we've gone from "NO WAY JOSE" (Hoe Zay for you furrin guys) to "HELL YEAH! - all you got to do is . . . "

I'd really love not to have to send an ecu off to an expensive tuner or buy expensive software, but if that's what it took and it was a guaranteed and simpler solution then I think it would be worth it. And while I love the VR6 there are better engines now out there. The GM & Ford stuff is super cheap because the engines come in everything. Most of the time you don't need to buy the fast & expensive engines, you just need to buy the fast ecus.

_________________
mobilito ergo sum
I drive therefore I am

I can explain it to you,
but I can't understand it for you.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: February 18, 2018, 4:30 pm 
Offline

Joined: August 26, 2010, 7:12 pm
Posts: 279
Location: Minneapolis
I have looked into the new ford stuff a little and I have the equipment here to clone the ECUs, but the at this time the info is just not out there yet. Ford however have kinda opened the flood gates with their crate engine ECUs. I have the equipment because Ford has Bosch stuff in it and I come from a VW/Audi background. If someone can find me a BIN file posted somewhere online, I would be happy to clone it to a junkyard ECU.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: February 18, 2018, 5:31 pm 
Offline

Joined: August 26, 2010, 7:12 pm
Posts: 279
Location: Minneapolis
I may have just found the immobilizer off file for focus st LOL


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: February 19, 2018, 1:40 pm 
Offline
The voice of reason
User avatar

Joined: January 10, 2008, 4:47 pm
Posts: 7550
Location: Massachusetts
Hi slappynuts, curious if you know what they use for a processor on the ECU's you're talking about. I had a project for awhile to build an ECU and had boards fabricated for it. I'm sitting here looking at a few thousand dollars worth of parts on my work bench that I didn't bother to have assembled onto the boards, partly because I was still learning how to build really good protection on the inputs. I know that now, but my tools for designing the board stopped working. Sometimes I think I should take the time to get back to that stuff.

The new ECU hardware can do things like measure spark duration and how long it takes for the fuel injector pintle to start moving. Actually that's the old new stuff. The new new stuff could also analyze a bunch of stuff about the cars performance like cornering forces and suspension movements etc...

_________________
Marcus Barrow - Car9 an open design community supported sports car for home builders!
SketchUp collection for LocostUSA: "Dream it, Build it, Drive it!"
Car9 Roadster information - models, drawings, resources etc.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: February 22, 2018, 4:46 am 
Offline

Joined: August 26, 2010, 7:12 pm
Posts: 279
Location: Minneapolis
I talked to one of the Ford tuners I know, and he said he can delete the PATS from the code, so you are good to go with the 2l ecoboost. He said its $300+$6 shipping.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: February 22, 2018, 4:50 am 
Offline

Joined: August 26, 2010, 7:12 pm
Posts: 279
Location: Minneapolis
horizenjob wrote:
Hi slappynuts, curious if you know what they use for a processor on the ECU's you're talking about. I had a project for awhile to build an ECU and had boards fabricated for it. I'm sitting here looking at a few thousand dollars worth of parts on my work bench that I didn't bother to have assembled onto the boards, partly because I was still learning how to build really good protection on the inputs. I know that now, but my tools for designing the board stopped working. Sometimes I think I should take the time to get back to that stuff.

The new ECU hardware can do things like measure spark duration and how long it takes for the fuel injector pintle to start moving. Actually that's the old new stuff. The new new stuff could also analyze a bunch of stuff about the cars performance like cornering forces and suspension movements etc...


Infineon c167


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: February 22, 2018, 10:27 pm 
Offline

Joined: October 19, 2009, 9:36 pm
Posts: 2083
Location: meadview arizona
slappy,

the focus uses an oak processor, can you take PATS out of that?

i have a Ford EEC_V made after 2002 and in the scalers the PATS is not a switch (1 or 0) its a number, in my case its 70 so what do you do to kill that?

the pre 2002 EEC_V and EEC_IV are simpler, especially the EEC_IV and everybody starts with a A9L stratergy.

comments please

_________________
this story shall the good man teach his son,
and chrispin chrispian shall ne'er go by,
from this day to the end of the world.
but we in it shall be remembered.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: February 23, 2018, 12:56 am 
Offline
Toyotaphobe
User avatar

Joined: April 5, 2008, 2:25 am
Posts: 4704
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
Slappy what software do you use on the Bosch stuff since HPTuners doesn't work with Bosch?

_________________
mobilito ergo sum
I drive therefore I am

I can explain it to you,
but I can't understand it for you.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: February 23, 2018, 6:34 pm 
Offline

Joined: August 26, 2010, 7:12 pm
Posts: 279
Location: Minneapolis
john hennessy wrote:
slappy,

the focus uses an oak processor, can you take PATS out of that?

i have a Ford EEC_V made after 2002 and in the scalers the PATS is not a switch (1 or 0) its a number, in my case its 70 so what do you do to kill that?

the pre 2002 EEC_V and EEC_IV are simpler, especially the EEC_IV and everybody starts with a A9L stratergy.

comments please


I personally do not, but I talked to a ford tuner that can.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: February 23, 2018, 6:38 pm 
Offline

Joined: August 26, 2010, 7:12 pm
Posts: 279
Location: Minneapolis
carguy123 wrote:
Slappy what software do you use on the Bosch stuff since HPTuners doesn't work with Bosch?


For the VW stuff its all freeware from the nefmoto forum. There are hardware/software programs that will read and write all these ECUs, but until someone can correct the checksums and delete the immobilizer in the code, its all for nothing. The ME7 cars have over 70 checksums in them and I have heard the newer stuff is even worse.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 15 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
POWERED_BY