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 Post subject: Re: ZETEC T5 HOW-TO/FAQ
PostPosted: January 8, 2014, 7:22 pm 
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Joined: March 10, 2006, 12:48 am
Posts: 282
Location: CT
Interesting find here:
http://www.mgexp.com/phorum/read.php?40%2C2568556%3Cimg

Quote:
Our MGB Zetec swap went pretty well, but mating the Zetec to the Ford 2.3 bellhousing took a lot of work. We had to adapt the bell with some brazed on tabs drill some holes, trim a block plate, figure out a release mechanism.... Since then, we've found a much easier way to bolt on a RWD bell for a wide range of transmission choices.

A little background:

In the late 80's OMC used the Ford 2.3 OHC as an inboard motor. In order to mate that engine to the OMC outdrive, they cast an adapter. On the 2.3 OHC engine there are two different bolt patterns - the usual 2.3 pattern and the older "pinto" pattern. The main difference is the location of the two upper bolts. OMC used the "pinto" pattern which happens to be the same as the Zetec. That "pinto" pattern is also found on the 2.0 OHC, 1600, 1.9CVH, and the 2.3/2/5 HSC engines.

The OMC outdrive is based on a Chevy V8 bellhousing pattern. So, the OMC adapter has a Zetec pattern interfaced with the Chevy bell pattern. The starter holes are indexed allow a Mustang/Ranger 2.3 starter with the Ford 2.3 or Escort 1.9 flywheel, either of which will fit the Zetec.

So, by bolting the adapter to the engine, you can bolt on an inexpensive corporate Chevy bell. That makes transmission possibilities pretty broad. Muncie 3 or4 spd, T5, NV3500, T56, 700R4, 200-4R, 4L60, or even a 2 spd Powerglide. And because the pilot shaft on a typical GM transmission is the same as the Zetec (.590"winking smiley, no special pilot bushing is needed.
Only a few easy things are needed to use this plate:
1. make a stepped index bushing for the engine side (.600" to .500"winking smiley,
2. drill for a .625" transmission index bushing on the transmission side,
3. modify the Zetec pan to clear the low mounted starter like we did for the MGB, (a 15 minute job on the bandsaw),
4. Trim the adapter to fit around the rear main seal on the Zetec.


Here are some pix of the adapter plate. We're collecting parts now for another Zetec MGB swap that will use this adapter, a Jeep/Chevy/T5 bell, and a Camaro T5 transmission. Stay tuned...


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PostPosted: July 12, 2014, 10:04 am 
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Joined: July 12, 2014, 9:47 am
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So I have been having issues with my 2.0L ztec. The issue being when I start it the idle is fine but when I add any throttle load it begins to surge erraticly. I suspected fuel pump issues but the pump is pushing good pressire all the way to the fuel rail. I have sense replaced the coil pack and plugs but with no sucess. I'm now suspect of the pcv valve but am unsure of the location. It is a dohc 2.0l ztec I think it is a mkIII motor any help with the location and this issue would be great. Thank you
Travis


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 Post subject: Re: ZETEC T5 HOW-TO/FAQ
PostPosted: November 24, 2014, 8:33 am 
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Has anyone used the RWD Motorsport bell housing to mate an American Zetec to a T-5?


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 Post subject: Re: ZETEC T5 HOW-TO/FAQ
PostPosted: November 24, 2014, 8:32 pm 
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I did not see any bell housings that make that claim. The Ford gear boxes they mention are Type 9, not T5. Totally didfferent transmissions.

Bill


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PostPosted: November 24, 2014, 8:39 pm 
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Location: san francisco bay area
ztec13 wrote:
So I have been having issues with my 2.0L ztec. The issue being when I start it the idle is fine but when I add any throttle load it begins to surge erraticly. I suspected fuel pump issues but the pump is pushing good pressire all the way to the fuel rail. I have sense replaced the coil pack and plugs but with no sucess. I'm now suspect of the pcv valve but am unsure of the location. It is a dohc 2.0l ztec I think it is a mkIII motor any help with the location and this issue would be great. Thank you
Travis

Check your MAP sensor. ..

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"There are times when a broken tool is better than a sound one, or a twisted personality more useful than a whole one.
For instance, a whole beer bottle isn't half the weapon that half a beer bottle is ..." Randall Garrett


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 Post subject: Re: ZETEC T5 HOW-TO/FAQ
PostPosted: May 11, 2015, 7:10 pm 
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Joined: May 27, 2006, 9:46 pm
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Location: BC, Canada. eh?
Here's a blast from the past...

I reported (a couple of years ago) that I had a major issue with my Zetec starter fouling on my Fidanza aluminum flywheel's ring gear. I'm using a Quad4Rods bellhousing (a seriously beautiful piece of kit, that, BTW!) on a non-V8 "World Class" ford T-5.

I've done tons of research on this problem (and found one or two references in the UK to people having to oval starter holes to deal with this issue), and been wracking my tiny brain for a very long time on it.

Over the past couple of days, I finally got off my duff and attacked the problem with a vengeance.

Turns out, my original (automatic) starter actually fit without fouling although, of course, it wouldn't work (snout, etc. too short, bolt pattern differs). The new manual-trans starter, though...not a chance. :BH:

In comparing the original one to my (aftermarket) manual-transmission starter, after taking & re-taking dozens of measurements, I finally noticed a difference!! The aftermarket starter's alignment ridge (the one that's supposed to fit snugly into the opening of the bell housing) was about 0.5 mm larger in diameter than the one on the automatic starter, and a hair larger than the hole! :shock:

A little cautious work with a file and *click*, it slotted right into place! Just to be on the safe side, I spun the engine over by hand with the starter in place, and there was no interference at all with the flywheel.

Success, at long last! :cheers:

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Scratch building, at continental-drift speed, a custom McSoreley-design framed, dual-Weber 45DCOE carburated, Zetec-engined, ridiculously fast money pit.

http://zetec7.webs.com/


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 Post subject: Re: ZETEC T5 HOW-TO/FAQ
PostPosted: July 11, 2016, 5:01 pm 
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Location: Chesapeake Va.
Don't know if this will help any one, for the Zetec engine there is a rear sump oil pan that is off the Ford Contour. It is 2 & 7/8' deep near the drain plug and 2 & 1/2" deep at the back of the pan. If you want to level the pan at the bottom then the engine is at a 13 degree angle with the intake cam at the high point. With a level pan and the cam cover at the high point the engine is 24 & 1/4". Part # for the pan is F7RZ6675 AA and can be found on e-bay. Oil pickup tubes are Melling 326S and 327S select the right one for your application.

Red


Attachments:
Zetec oil pan 001.JPG
Zetec oil pan 001.JPG [ 1006.68 KiB | Viewed 7663 times ]
Zetec oil pan 002.JPG
Zetec oil pan 002.JPG [ 999.71 KiB | Viewed 7663 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: ZETEC T5 HOW-TO/FAQ
PostPosted: July 11, 2016, 5:23 pm 
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Location: BC, Canada. eh?
Red, you're a scholar and a gentleman! For those of us muddling our way through Zetec builds, this is pure gold. Your engine, by the way, looks spectacular. Hmm...looks like I'm going to need to do some paint work on mine!

BTW, did you cut off the angled "wing" on the bottom of the alloy part of the pan? On my engine, it hangs down just as far as the original oil pan...

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Scratch building, at continental-drift speed, a custom McSoreley-design framed, dual-Weber 45DCOE carburated, Zetec-engined, ridiculously fast money pit.

http://zetec7.webs.com/


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 Post subject: Re: ZETEC T5 HOW-TO/FAQ
PostPosted: July 12, 2016, 7:43 am 
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Location: Chesapeake Va.
Zetec7

If you are referring to the high piece at the left side of the first pic, no I have not. At this point it is only about a 1/2" above the pan. Until I get the bellhousing and engine into the car for mock up to see where things sit will I know what needs to be done. That is still a ways down the road.

Red


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 Post subject: Re: ZETEC T5 HOW-TO/FAQ
PostPosted: July 12, 2016, 12:13 pm 
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Location: BC, Canada. eh?
Okay, thanks. On mine, when viewed with the engine right side up, that high piece angles sharply downward, projecting down probably 1.5" lower than the left, reducing ground clearance by a bunch.

My Quad4Rods bellhousing has a section that matches that projection. My thinking was to cut both of those off so they're level, which would give me another 1.5" ground clearance (50% more than I have right now!).

I'll try to post a pic to show what I'm talking about...

Here it is - this is on the right side of the engine compartment, looking rearward toward the bellhousing (center, far left, in the picture). The original metal portion of the steel sump section is visible just above center, at the right of the picture (this is the section of the steel sump section that's NOT a problem).

I figure the alloy projection in the pic can be safely removed to level it. You can see the lowest part of the frame (center, left, in the picture - a removable frame tube section for ease of engine removal, 3/4" lower than the rest of the frame) for an idea of clearance. For reference, the frame, at that point, has 5.25" ground clearance.

Attachment:
File comment: Drop at rear of alloy (upper section) of sump & matching bellhousing drop
sump angle small.jpg
sump angle small.jpg [ 101.68 KiB | Viewed 7620 times ]


For clarity, here's a picture of the entire sump's clearance issue:

Attachment:
File comment: View of the OEM 2-piece sump, center of underside of car, looking rearward (centerline of car marked in Sharpie, on frame, top of pic)
Sump 4 small labeled.jpg
Sump 4 small labeled.jpg [ 202.78 KiB | Viewed 7620 times ]


It's my hope that Red's different-steel-sump idea will eliminate most of these issues!

_________________
Scratch building, at continental-drift speed, a custom McSoreley-design framed, dual-Weber 45DCOE carburated, Zetec-engined, ridiculously fast money pit.

http://zetec7.webs.com/


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 Post subject: Re: ZETEC T5 HOW-TO/FAQ
PostPosted: July 27, 2016, 3:11 am 
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Time to update my progress on the Zetec sump-shortening.

I did get one of the pans suggested by Reddragon, and for many it may help for clearance issues. Unfortunately, it's only about 1/8" shorter overall than my OEM pan, so it didn't give me the ground clearance I needed (I was looking for about 1 1/2"). If anyone needs one of those, let me know - I can make you SUCH a deal!

Anyway I decided to shorten the steel pan myself. I got 1.5" out of it, which takes me from a paltry 3" of ground clearance to a respectable (well, usable) 4 1/2", or maybe even 4 3/4". Thankfully, I just picked up a spare engine, now mounted inverted on my engine stand, which makes working on the pan a breeze. Once I've finished the pan, I'll install it on the engine in my Locost when I pull the engine in preparation for frame painting.

Interestingly, I was able to still use the original plastic oil pickup tube! As it happens, the Zetec pickup tube has a screen (of course), plus a kind of flattened conical "snorkel" below that. The snorkel can be shortened over 1.5", while still maintaining the integrity of the pickup, screen, screen holder, etc. In my case, I've left clearance of about 2 mm. between the bottom of the pickup and the bottom of the pan itself, so even very low oil volume in the pan (say, during hard cornering or braking) should still keep the snout of the pickup submerged in oil.

The bottom of the pan (not yet welded closed) is now parallel with the ground when the engine is level in the frame (the pan used to hang down 1 1/2" lower on the right side than the left - presumably, the engine was tilted in the Focus...? Setting up a jig to accurately mark the cut line was a fun task, as the pan had to be mounted on a 13.8 degree angle so I could mark around the perimeter (I screwed it down onto a piece of plywood, then used wedges to prop the plywood up at the correct angle). Then, I made a jig to hold a silver Sharpie that I could use to circumnavigate the pan & accurately draw the cut line. Worked great!

I cut the pan with my 4 1/2" angle grinder & .5 mm cutting disc, which made short work of it. I used the grinder to cut the snout on the pickup tube, too.

I calculated that shortening the pan removed a tad under .5 liters from the pan's total volume. To be safe, I've fabricated a steel "box" that extends the deepest portion of the pan rearward, increasing its total volume by over 1 liter (almost 1.5 liters). So, in total, I'm up between 0.5 and 1.0 liter over stock capacity. While I haven't checked the dipstick for clearance yet (my spare engine doesn't have one), I don't think it will be a problem, as it goes into the left side of the pan, where it was only shortened by maybe 1 mm.

I'll be making a single-piece bottom for the pan, covering both the cut area + the extension area. I'll be drilling several holes to allow the oil to flow to & from the extension, which will provide some baffling as a bonus (it didn't have any originally).

To be on the safe side, I'm going to have a local specialty welder TIG weld it for me, after I tack it all together with my MIG. It's not that I don't trust my MIG welds, but rather that I believe there will be less chance of a leak with TIG, and besides...them TIG welds is purty!!

Here's a few pics of it, in-progress. Hopefully, this will be helpful to others in the same predicament!! :cheers:

Attachment:
File comment: Pan cut, snorkel still unmodified
IMG_1151bsmall.jpg
IMG_1151bsmall.jpg [ 69.74 KiB | Viewed 7584 times ]


Attachment:
File comment: Snorkel sticking up above cut line in pan
IMG_1153bsmall.jpg
IMG_1153bsmall.jpg [ 57.79 KiB | Viewed 7584 times ]


Attachment:
File comment: Pan cut, oil pickup tube snout shortened, fabricated pan extension trial fit
Img_1243small.jpg
Img_1243small.jpg [ 283.77 KiB | Viewed 7584 times ]

_________________
Scratch building, at continental-drift speed, a custom McSoreley-design framed, dual-Weber 45DCOE carburated, Zetec-engined, ridiculously fast money pit.

http://zetec7.webs.com/


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 Post subject: Re: ZETEC T5 HOW-TO/FAQ
PostPosted: July 27, 2016, 7:28 am 
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If it's not to late think about adding a hinge to cover the holes going to the new rear sump area. Will help keep the oil around the pick-up tube during acceleration. Dave W


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 Post subject: Re: ZETEC T5 HOW-TO/FAQ
PostPosted: July 27, 2016, 11:30 am 
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Hmmm - cool idea! It's not too late - I haven't tacked the extension box on yet.

I'm familiar with the concept, but I've never seen it done. Is the idea to seal it up completely (tougher to do, due to the pan's convoluted shape), or just to slow it down quite a bit ( a lot easier)?

I was planning a series of, say, 1/2" holes to let the oil flow forward out of the extension box into the pan, but I could put a hinged flap in there to cover them. Due to the shape of that area of the original pan, the flap would tend to stay closed normally due to gravity, but I would think that any real volume of oil behind it would push it open...

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Scratch building, at continental-drift speed, a custom McSoreley-design framed, dual-Weber 45DCOE carburated, Zetec-engined, ridiculously fast money pit.

http://zetec7.webs.com/


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 Post subject: Re: ZETEC T5 HOW-TO/FAQ
PostPosted: July 28, 2016, 9:05 am 
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Location: Chesapeake Va.
Zetec

Sorry the reverse pan did not work out for you.

If you were to make a couple half holes along the top of divider between the front and rear sump, this being the bottom of both sumps, using the bulk of the divider as a wall it would slow the oil from going into the back part on acceleration.

Like how you re-constructed the pan.

Red


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 Post subject: Re: ZETEC T5 HOW-TO/FAQ
PostPosted: July 28, 2016, 9:14 am 
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Location: 4AGE in S.E. Michigan
The 1/2" holes should be good. [ just above the bottom of the pan surface.] After you straighten the one curved area. I actually found some lite wt cheap hinges that had one side about +1" longer. You can use the short side hinge mounting holes for attaching i.e. puddles welds. I also put a small tack weld on the press-in hinge pin. I was worried about the engine virbs. Dave W


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