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Learning how to build Lotus Seven replicas...together!
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PostPosted: December 1, 2019, 7:52 am 
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For a locost, I’d put together something like this for about $90/pair:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/5-75-LED-Dayma ... 935477e312
Just a standard 5.75 inch motorcycle bucket with a 40w or less, glass lens versus yellowing plastic, projector led assembly then add the little block of aluminum at the bottom to provide side to side adjustment. Another, more flexible option is to fit replaceable bulb glass lens assemblies for H4 bulbs/leds. Then if you are not satisfied, the watts, lumens, and color can be changed for a lot less $. I could put together a pair of these for about $100 in black. A pair of stud mount buckets costs about $40, in black or chrome.
Black stud mount
https://www.ebay.com/itm/5-3-4-5-75-Inc ... SwXyBcGe43
Chrome stud mount
https://www.ebay.com/itm/VOSICKY-5-3-47 ... SwBixdbGyr
*High quality reflector to shape low beam and glass lens H4 bulb holders from autopal for $32/pair:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1-Pairs-5-3-4- ... SwUf9cjA5J
*Locost H4 led 35w 4000lm per bulb (hi and lo), slightly brighter than halogens for $12/pair. No fans but low power so it may not be needed and the most power/fuel efficient:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/3570-H4-LED-He ... fresh=true
Locost, lowest pwr assemblies with 30w 2800nl low beam for about $25 each but still much brighter and may not be glass lens:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/5-75-5-3-4-Mot ... g&LH_BIN=1

It is also worth noting that while a lot of these assys have DOT markings, that doesn't necessarily mean they are marked as headlights. In some cases they could have the right marks yet not meet the specs for glare.


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PostPosted: December 6, 2019, 7:11 pm 
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These were perfect except not much difference switching to high but much brighter and apparently not blinding anybody. You install the adapter ring first, rotate the led body out of it, install the original bulb lock ring, then reinsert the led. Go by the bold specs, not the ones at the bottom which seem to be for a different bulb:
9004/HB1 type, 6000k color, 2000 lumens, 36w (18w each)

https://www.ebay.com/itm/9004-HB1-LED-H ... 2749.l2649

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PostPosted: December 8, 2019, 8:39 am 
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Do NOT buy this design led:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/9004-HB1-LED-H ... 2749.l2649

Note the size of the led between the rivets is smaller than most (likely lower output and watts), there is no cooling fan (for lower output cooling requirements), and there is no space for a headlight locking ring to fit between the o ring collar and the finned round body. The collar was poorly shaped with hand tools on the inside and they don't fit. I could modify the lock ring to have a greater id or grind the cooling fins back at the base to make these fit. I'll modify them to fit to see how bright they are.

FYI, typical of headlight leds, the collar goes on, the original head light lock ring behind it, then the bulb goes in and locks with a qtr turn.

Also note crazy high output advertised.

I recommend "C6" design leds. The quality is much better than anything else and the price is about the same.

One thing is the high beam doesn't do much but the low beam makes up for it.

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PostPosted: December 19, 2019, 10:04 pm 
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Location: Cornholio OR "Where the magic happens"
Generally it is difficult (if not impossible) to place an LED bulb In a fixture designed for a halogen type bulb, and be DOT approved.

Even those HID bulb kits do not honor the DOT standards.

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PostPosted: January 1, 2020, 7:50 am 
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Thanks for the reminder BW. Yeah, the topic has drifted to everybody else is doing it so I might as well give it a go. :cheers:

I found hi beam is an afterthought on these. The last ones I bought had no hi beam. Switching hi just changed the pin the power came in on. I always wanted the hella projectors that use a servo door to control hi lo but would never pay the crazy amounts they wanted. I do like the greatly reduced load. The engine idle would drop momentarily until the ecm could deal with the greater load when cutting the lights on but not any more.

If an application had separate hi and low beam bulbs, then it could work well with an equivalent to incandescent low and a separate hi bulb with ample output but there seems to be no way to have a true hi/lo equiv of 35/55w. It seems to be one or the other.

Ordered a retrofit projector kit for my wifes car that uses the servo door. It is a early 90s bubble back mazda 323 so no off the shelf projector lights are available. Uses standard bulb sockets with the appropriate adapter ring that is included. Kit has glass lenses and costs about $30 compared to $300 for hella. They come with a door shape depending on left hand drive or right hand drive applications.

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PostPosted: January 2, 2020, 9:37 am 
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My question is, is it the bulb/lens combo that needs DOT approval, or does the headlight shell also require approval?

Thom


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PostPosted: January 2, 2020, 12:22 pm 
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Shells with specific bulbs are tested for compliance. Mfgs of leds, incandescents, and hid make lights that will physically interchange with the compliant bulbs. Untested and most are unlikely to pass but nobody is testing after a vehicle is in use or during certification of a home built, only looking for appropriate markings on the shell. Not much point in testing when as soon as the vehicle is titled, the owner can treat it like any other vehicle and swap the bulbs in a few seconds.

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PostPosted: January 3, 2020, 4:05 pm 
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Location: Cornholio OR "Where the magic happens"
For a non-sealed beam the shell, reflector and lens, are what is certified.
But that certification is for a specific type of bulb.

Aftermarket LED or HID or high wattage halogen will fall outside that certification.
I have a sort of night blindness and am very sensitive to these "uncertified" combinations.
So I am keenly aware of these issues and my concern is to NOT blind on-coming drivers.

The DOT approved projector LED systems are superior for both your vision and on-coming drivers as they have a sharp horizontal cutoff and focus all the light where you need it, with minimal splatter.
The splattered light is not useful to your vision and is what blinds on-coming drivers.
Well worth the extra expense for obvious safety reasons.

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PostPosted: January 3, 2020, 9:51 pm 
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Thanks Bent Wrench. I just noticed your statement at the bottom. Like it. Reminds me of what I tell people:

"The value of a driver's license is- it tells you who you are and where you should go at the end of the day!"

Thom


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PostPosted: January 4, 2020, 9:55 am 
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Again, different bulbs than what was used for certification are technically wrong because they are different.That does not mean they can't pass testing. Most would not. No testing when you have your build inspected, just looking for markings. No roadside testing. That doesn't make it a good idea to blind drivers. Glare output is very important and a primary criteria for selecting lights.

There are aftermarket LED assemblies that are DOT and E code approved.

By putting good info out there, drivers can make better decisions when they retrofit LED lights because they are going to eventually for a number of reasons including less load on the alternator for improved mpg. I see more older vehicles equipped with LEDs everyday. It isn't safer to be the last holdout for incandescents. I think most drivers will make their best guess and use whatever they end up buying, even if it is blinding other drivers with excess glare. It is coming and ignoring it is the worst thing to do imho, so I don't mind buying a few sets to experiment with if it will help me to educate myself and trickle through the web to anybody I may eventually have to share the road with. There seems to be mostly a vacuum right now. My humble contribution.

A traditional housing uses the shape of the reflector and usually bits of metal near the bulb to shape the output beam, so switching to a led version of an incandescent, even if the amount of lumens produced are identical, may result in a light that does not pass the glare test. That is because the pattern of light from the incandescent may be different than the pattern produced by a led. It depends on the led design. There are many different designs. Better designs have adjustable clocking to fine tune the cut offs. Generally, installed incandescent bulb elements are horizontal while most of the current design leds have vertical chips facing each side. Incandescent bulbs can be coated on the end to block direct light and/or have a metal deflector in the housing to block it. A forward facing chip is pointless.

E code and DOT standards are very similar but in my experience with traditional housings, e codes have less glare but are also more effective at lighting the way.

A DOT approved projector housing has a smooth reflector and a blocker for low only, nothing in the way for hi. A hi/lo projector requires a servo door. The shape of the edge of the door determines the cut off and if the application is for left or right hand drive. A projector should be less sensitive to the bulb pattern than traditional housings.

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PostPosted: January 5, 2020, 10:37 am 
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I ordered the wrong projector for my housing bulb type and they don't make a retro kit for mine. I could mod it by convert to different bulbs, different wiring sockets, modifying the projector for a different hole pattern and trimming the housing mount stems, but I've decided not to install it. I ordered a kit that fits H1, H4, and H7 bulb housings but this application uses HB1/9004 bulbs.

Here is a 1993 mazda 323 DOT approved housing and metal glare blocker. Nothing special about the reflector or the blocker and it meets the requirements. The lens has no special shapes or fluting to it. Butyl tape fills the groove and metal snap clips keep the lens on. Warming the housing in an oven for a few minutes at less than 180degf is all that is needed to pull of the lens with a butter knife helper. Very easy. It should warmed again when reassembling for less stress on the plastic.

I have a spare housing I will take apart and take pics of the internal arrangement with both the standard replacement bulb and any leds I have that fit the housing.

The kit looks well made. The reflector is metal. It doesn't come with any instructions so I've shown how the retaining clip fits into the flange. The hosuign is labeled top and bottom, the reflector is oval, not round, the black plastic guard blocks glare light out the sides more effectively than the dot box deflector imho. The guard must be installed to block glare.

You can see the servo system with the door that has the blocker in the low beam position with no power applied. It comes with a socket that needs to be cut off to jumper ground and power from the hi beam circuit to engage the servo with hi beam selection.

The down the bulb hole shows these to be left hand drive with the dip notch to the left side, blocking light toward the oncoming traffic. The steel blocker could be trimmed or added to block less or more light as needed.

The projector is designed to bolt to the housing by clamping to the back of the housing with a round nut (shown in the pic with the hardware) on the threaded reflector housing. The holes in the flange are for attaching the glare blocker. It is likely the original blocker stems would have to be removed to clear the projector body so there is no going back without some fab to rebuild the original blocker stems or use longer screws and spacers. The white parts are silicone seals to prevent water intrusion through the bulb hole. Head lights are vented, usually with a rubber hose connected to a hole or two near the top (see two holes in pic of 323 reflector). Three screws retain the ring that holds the bulb flange. These accept standard original bulbs for the application but technically deviate from the certification basis the same as swapping to different bulbs.


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lts 001.jpg
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lts 005.jpg
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lts 006.jpg
lts 006.jpg [ 86.5 KiB | Viewed 3289 times ]

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