LocostUSA.com

I guess I'm not too worried about it. I'm not sure what anyone would do with my car if they stole it. It's not worth a lot. Maybe sell the wheels.

Instead of running a normal key, or just a switch I'm planning out a system that would use a magnetic switch that turns on the ignition relay. you can hide it anywhere behind the dash and no one would know how to turn the ignition on.

The guys over on Locostbuilders probably have some threads on this. As I understand it British IVA regulations call for some kind of anti-theft or "immobilizer" system.

Take your Buddy.

Plus, you have to know to push the car around until it faces north to start it!

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Marcus Barrow - Car9 an open design community supported sports car for home builders!
SketchUp collection for LocostUSA: "Dream it, Build it, Drive it!"
Car9 Roadster information - models, drawings, resources etc.

Just for safety's sake, I'm installing a Ford inertial fuel pump cutoff switch (available at any wrecking yard...cheap! I think I paid $1 for two of 'em). Once it's triggered, there's no fuel, and unless you know what's caused it to quit, that there's a switch, what it looks like, and where it is, the car ain't running until another pump & wire are rigged up. In addition, an impact of consequence will shut off the fuel & help prevent a fire. Getting it going again is as simple as depressing the big red button, and it's back to normal.

All good things, IMHO. My switch is going in the locked trunk.

For those who don't know about them, they look like this:



They're dirt simple to wire up, too - basically, a hot lead in & another out to the pump. Trigger the switch, and there's no power continuity to the pump.

A good place to find one is in the trunk of a Fox body Mustang, on the left side. Remove one or two screws, disconnect the connector (cut the connector off the harness, too, & keep some wire with it, to make wiring it up in your car easier).

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Scratch building, at continental-drift speed, a custom McSoreley-design framed, dual-Weber 45DCOE carburated, Zetec-engined, ridiculously fast money pit.

http://zetec7.webs.com/

Yes and when you drive a Ford Van along a bumpy country road a million miles from nowhere and that triggers the switch and you have to pay a jillion dollars for a Sunday tow back in from the boon docks to the big city only to have the guy at the shop just push a button, that's a piece of equipment you never forget.

I'm not saying that happened to me, but it happened to a close personal friend of mine.

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mobilito ergo sum
I drive therefore I am

I can explain it to you,
but I can't understand it for you.

I looked this up because I was wondering if you could trigger it somehow by tilting it or something. Maybe it makes sense to install this someplace that is inconspicuous and reachable by the driver.

_________________
Marcus Barrow - Car9 an open design community supported sports car for home builders!
SketchUp collection for LocostUSA: "Dream it, Build it, Drive it!"
Car9 Roadster information - models, drawings, resources etc.

I think this is a great discussion. I don't have a plan, but I'd like to have something on my build. My donor was a '94 mustang, which has the inertial fuel pump shutoff. I'm going to run that as a safety device.

I will have a removable steering wheel and that's a deterrent, but some idiot bubba with a big set of Channel Locks or a big vice grip could still steer it a little bit. Taking a steering wheel with you all the time is a big bother too.

I was thinking of a toggle switch that would cause the battery hot lead to disconnect, like with a relay or something. Put the toggle up under the dash where nobody would think to look. That way if they hot wired it, no power would be available to start it.

Thoughts?

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Damn! That front slip angle is way too large and the Ackerman is just a muddle.

Build Log: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=5886

Are you guys sure about that switch? It's basically a ball on a small sprung pedestal, where enough shock knocks the ball off the pedestal and opens the pump circuit. You push the button to depress the pedestal and the ball ends up back on the top of it. AFAIK, there's no way to open the switch manually short of whacking it.

_________________
Midlana book: Build this mid-engine Locost!, http://midlana.com/stuff/book/
Kimini book: Designing mid-engine cars using FWD drivetrains
Both available from https://www.lulu.com/

Yeah, that's how they work. It takes a pretty good thump to trigger it, though - there's no way a bumpy road would do it. If it's mounted vertically, with the button facing up, it needs a longitudinal impact to trigger it (such as a side, front, or rear impact). It's designed that way on purpose, and vertical thumps (such as a large bump while driving) don't trigger it. I've tried, whacking it with a screwdriver handle. Smack it as hard as you like from the top or bottom, and nothing happens.

I was a professional crash investigator, analyst, and reconstructionist for about 15 years, as well as attending non-serious crashes, traffic tie-ups, etc. I've seen many (I'd estimate between 50-100) of these switches triggered, and in every single case, it was a situation when you'd want it to have triggered. I was often a "hero" when I could get a Ford to fire right up after a crash (serious enough to have been dangerous, but not enough to leave the car completely undriveable) by disappearing into the car for a moment, pushing the button, and saying "There. NOW try it!"

In the event that you install one of these, and find yourself miles from nowhere with a failed switch, simply joining the two wires together (bypassing the switch) will return normal fuel flow. I've heard rumors that it's possible for one of these switches to fail, but never actually found a first-hand report. When you play with one of them, it's hard to imagine any way to get one to fail.

Perhaps spilling a latte with cream & sugar into it might be able to gum it up but, failing that, they seem pretty much a foolproof design.

The connector has 3 wires. The skinny one is not used, and has no connection inside the switch assembly. I simply cut off the 3rd, skinny wire, and wired the other two across my fuel pump power wire. I've tried it, giving it smacks from various angles to simulate a crash, and it works great.

It's certainly better than getting in a crash & having the pump continue to pour fuel out everywhere.

Cheap, cheap, cheap insurance, IMHO.

_________________
Scratch building, at continental-drift speed, a custom McSoreley-design framed, dual-Weber 45DCOE carburated, Zetec-engined, ridiculously fast money pit.

http://zetec7.webs.com/

I agree with all the above; I was just pointing out that there seems to be an impression in this thread that the switch can be used as a security switch. I assume the thinking is that the car can be parked and the switch pressed to keep the car from being driven. No - it's just the opposite, pressing the switch resets it. They aren't made to be "switched off."

_________________
Midlana book: Build this mid-engine Locost!, http://midlana.com/stuff/book/
Kimini book: Designing mid-engine cars using FWD drivetrains
Both available from https://www.lulu.com/

Zetec I'm going to have to disagree with you that a bumpy road won't set it off because it did for me and left me stranded out in the middle of nowhere and cost me a fortune to just have someone simply press the red button.

Now the old style Ford vans were very flexible, so much so that I could cross a railroad track and see daylight between the 2 back doors so maybe it flexed more than a normal vehicle, but it could and did set it off.

_________________
mobilito ergo sum
I drive therefore I am

I can explain it to you,
but I can't understand it for you.

Way back when, I rebuilt a kit car. I wired it with a bunch of unlabeled switches, one of which controlled nothing. One energized the coil. It also had an ignition key. I think that is a damn good antitheft arrangement. I don't think you can prevent a dedicated thief, but you can easily stop your average teenager, most of which, due to the complexity of the modern car, have no idea how a car operates.

Bill

The quote I found indicated it can be used to shut off the fuel system. I've never opened one up, but you could imagine the ball hits a switch when it's dislodged and the same action that sets the switch could also unset it. The quote seemed authoritative it was from a car repair site. The subject was actually "where did the switch go" because Ford no longer uses them and that function is now performed by the module that senses acceleration to trigger the seat belt tensioner devices...

Perhaps someone with one of these switches could confirm the car doesn't start after pressing the switch. You actually should just be able to hear that the fuel pump doesn't run. Then that person would be a hero on this web site for settling this issue. I think the switch is a good idea, the high pressure of a fuel injection system would be a bad thing if a line is ruptured in an accident, it would empty the gas tank onto the road or a hot engine/exhaust in a matter of just a few minutes.

_________________
Marcus Barrow - Car9 an open design community supported sports car for home builders!
SketchUp collection for LocostUSA: "Dream it, Build it, Drive it!"
Car9 Roadster information - models, drawings, resources etc.