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PostPosted: April 3, 2014, 5:44 pm 
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If the uprights/spindles are to be built, that is the way it will be done, maybe with tapered bearings instead though; the reason I started this thread however was to identify any other potential donors besides Miata/Mustang II, that could possibly save me and others some money/time. ;)

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PostPosted: April 3, 2014, 6:11 pm 
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HarryB wrote:
...In order to minimize compliance, you want the mounting points as far apart as possible within the wheel...
How certain are you that adding length (weight) to what is essentially a beam in bending, will necessarily the best way to minimize the deflection? This requires an additional increase in section properties (more weight) of the beam. Intuitively, I would think it might often add less total (and unsprung) weight by increasing the strength of the primary supporting tension/compression member(s), if necessary.

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Last edited by Driven5 on April 3, 2014, 6:45 pm, edited 5 times in total.

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PostPosted: April 3, 2014, 6:25 pm 
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People have used Chevette very successfully. Modernbeat ( a member here ) is a strong advocate here. I think he likes the steering axis is closer to the wheel mounting surface. We have a builder who used front spindles from 600Racing cars as used on their Legends or some such.

There is another one I liked but that sent me on an entire fruitless internet afternoon trying to search for it. I'll look some more or post a drawing. It used a weld in axle pin in a piece of square tubing for the upright. It was welded into a notch on the side of the tubing, I think, and it was claimed stronger that way. Had symmetrical bolt on steering arms.

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PostPosted: April 4, 2014, 3:12 am 
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@Justin

That's exactly what I had in mind, which didn't quite came through as intented. The upright istelf would have to be thicker (or more material away from its' centroid), but as the forces on the A-arms would be significally lower and therefore the deflection induced by those (actually more by their mounts, and most of all by the usually single 5/8 bolt Stephan mentioned) would be much much lower.

@Marcus

Thanks a lot for your info. Indeed, the Chevette spindles seem rather nice, I want to do a 3D CAD out of them and run a quick FEA to compare with the Miata/Mustang ones. In the "spindle dimensions" thread there is a front view with dimensions and weight (on a red-painted spindle) but I cannot find sideview dimensions. Does anyone have accurate measurements of it? I would be more than happy to share the 3D CAD with you when done, as well as the comparative results with the Miata/Mustang.

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PostPosted: April 5, 2014, 11:06 pm 
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horizenjob wrote:
People have used Chevette very successfully. Modernbeat ( a member here ) is a strong advocate here. I think he likes the steering axis is closer to the wheel mounting surface...


Yep, the Chevette-Fiero spindles are the best North American OEM spindle I've seen. They are tiny, compact and light compared to the Miata spindles. The geometry -could- be improved with a custom spindle, but for our purposes they work well. In the photos below the wheel is a steel 13x10 and you can see that the spindle fits well into them with decent separation and angle on the ball joints.

I don't have a copy of it, but there are CAD models of the spindle on a CD I gave Jack when he bought my car and I assume he gave it to the next owner who is on this board.

Image

Image

Image


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PostPosted: April 6, 2014, 8:09 am 
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That sounds interesting, modernbeat. However, there does not seem to be much available in the aftermarket for hubs, rotors and calipers. Maybe I'm not looking in the right places. Any suggestions?
I was going to use Pinto/Mustang II spindles and this kit, http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Mustang-I ... ,2008.html , for the sake of convenience. But it has always bothered me that it is so massive. My rear axle is a Ford Mustang 7.5 in (same bolt pattern of the Speedway kit) due to the taller final drive. I'm also using a R1 engine.
I have thought about using different wheels front to rear, but it starts to become too complicated for a street application.
Appreciate your ideas.

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PostPosted: April 6, 2014, 12:54 pm 
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mgkluft wrote:
That sounds interesting, modernbeat. However, there does not seem to be much available in the aftermarket for hubs, rotors and calipers. Maybe I'm not looking in the right places. Any suggestions?...


You can juggle bearings and spacer sleeves to use almost any hub you want. Or you can just use the Fiero rotors. There are LOTS of DIY and commercial brake kits for the Fiero guys, since the car is used as the basis for many kit cars. Aside from that, it's easy to build a caliper adapter and use just about any caliper you want. The caliper ears on the spindle are set far enough back that an adapter will have plenty of strength. I did not find the 5x100 Fiero bolt pattern to be an issue, though I contemplated switching to 4x100.

If you are looking for a fully engineered, aftermarket, motorsports hub and brake solution, expect to spend $$$$ because it will be a very small production kit. You should be DIY this, which is easy enough. Here is an example of making a hub from a production rotor so slip-on rotors can be used. It's a common process.

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/126744.html


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PostPosted: April 6, 2014, 3:08 pm 
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Those Fiero spinldes look really nice, I will try to have a proper CAD and FEA on those as soon as possible, to compare with Miata/Mustang. In the meantime, and despite my disliking for bearing units, I came through the Pontiac Solstice uprights, and they look really neat and lightweight. Anyone here that has experiences with them?

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PostPosted: April 6, 2014, 4:29 pm 
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HarryB wrote:
Those Fiero spinldes look really nice, I will try to have a proper CAD and FEA on those as soon as possible, to compare with Miata/Mustang. In the meantime, and despite my disliking for bearing units, I came through the Pontiac Solstice uprights, and they look really neat and lightweight. Anyone here that has experiences with them?


Enough info to make your spindle calculations from:
viewtopic.php?t=1572

Also in the "spindle and upright measurements" thread:
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1292#p15597

There is a lot more info on the hub and brake interchange on the Fiero spindle in that second thread. And even more info scattered all over this site on bearings, hubs and brakes for them.

I've toyed with the Solstice parts. And the late MX5/RX8 front uprights. They both have their good points, but are not appropriate for a Seven. Both are too large and, for the most part, require too large of brakes and wheels to work with a lightweight car. If you are desperate for a good, small, unit bearing upright, use the front upright from the 1999+ 4x4 Chevy S10. It will still fit inside a 15" wheel and it has wide spaced caliper bosses that can be adapted to almost any caliper you can think of, including, I believe, the Wilwood H1 performance caliper. It uses the same bearing as the rear of a Corvette C4. The stock bearing has a speed sensor in it while the 'Vette bearing has no sensor.


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PostPosted: April 6, 2014, 6:25 pm 
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The Fiero/Chevette spindles are what the Ultrlight uses.

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PostPosted: April 9, 2019, 4:27 pm 
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Moderbeat, looking at the photos rod ends where used. Were the uprights simply drilled out and a bolt used?
TIA
Tony


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