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Learning how to build Lotus Seven replicas...together!
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 Post subject: All wheel drive Seven?
PostPosted: August 3, 2015, 10:40 am 
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Location: Mooresville, NC
While I know this concept is far from new, I've never seen anyone actually take the idea beyond initial thought.

Anyone know of one completed?

...and no, despite the username, I'm not going to use a Subaru because it would require the engine to be in front of the car haha

The idea is to essentially end up with a McSorley 442 that is front mounted, mid-engine layout with AWD. Obviously this requires me putting the front diff in-front of the engine. So the front box is going to be a bit busy. I'm thinking I'll end up moving the rack to the upper control arm. Put it in plane with a half upper arm makes the bump steer easily solved anyway.

Thoughts?

It was either this or continuing with the design of my exo-midi plan.

Funny thing is that I can buy the entire drivetrain from the AWD donor car (GTR), for less than my Porsche transaxle cost me.

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Last edited by Homemade WRX on August 3, 2015, 10:53 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: August 3, 2015, 10:48 am 
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That's why someone makes a reverse cut ring and pinion for the Subaru. So you can mount your Subaru stuff in the back for a AWD car... I don't have a pointer but try searching for things about putting Subaru engines in Porsches or something...

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PostPosted: August 3, 2015, 10:55 am 
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I've never heard of a reverse cut gear for the Subaru box and I know a lot of Subie stuff and swaps. All the P-car swaps just use adapter plates...that I've seen.

Also, if I was going to rear engine, I could just use Porsche transaxle and front diff.

Using the GTR bits, I can keep the engine in it's traditional location and keep it mid mounted.

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Last edited by Homemade WRX on August 3, 2015, 10:59 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: August 3, 2015, 10:59 am 
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Joined: March 15, 2013, 2:27 pm
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Location: Montreal, Quebec Canada
just an idea, using a motor/generator unit in the front and making the locks an hybrid awd, like the lemans car or the porsche 918 could be cool!

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PostPosted: August 3, 2015, 11:00 am 
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Joined: February 20, 2015, 12:04 pm
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Location: Cotswolds - UK
Homemade WRX wrote:
Anyone know of one completed?

Google: 'Dax Quadra'


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PostPosted: August 3, 2015, 11:05 am 
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@bobbeysr27
With one of the shops I work with, we'd discussed doing a hybrid AWD set up for a PPIHC car...but the controls are more of a headache than I would want for my personal toy car and something I'll drive on the street....not to mention it takes the 'lo' out of 'locost'.

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Last edited by Homemade WRX on August 3, 2015, 11:13 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: August 3, 2015, 11:12 am 
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Sam_68 wrote:
Homemade WRX wrote:
Anyone know of one completed?

Google: 'Dax Quadra'

Nice!! So I won't be the first and I won't be alone ;)

That 4.6 is a lot of iron to have up front in these cars!

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PostPosted: August 3, 2015, 11:15 am 
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Homemade WRX wrote:
That 4.6 is a lot of iron to have up front in these cars!

It's aluminium, so not quite as bad as it could be, but yes, with that much torque you can start to understand the need for 4WD!

They've built them with other engines, too, though, including Ford Cosworth turbo.


Last edited by Sam_68 on August 3, 2015, 11:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: August 3, 2015, 11:16 am 
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Joined: April 8, 2012, 7:05 pm
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Location: Warrens WI
Here is a link to the reverse cut Subaru R&P if anyone is interested.

http://www.subarugears.com/


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PostPosted: August 3, 2015, 4:21 pm 
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At the oddball end of the awd spectrum, there's the Tiger Z100.



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PostPosted: August 4, 2016, 5:27 pm 
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Entirely different application, but I had thought to use a FWD engine/trans combo installed longitudinally. Then an early Z car rear diff (R180 or R200) at each end. The compound reduction would require something that rev'd along with the tallest diff ratios that could be found. My thought was a diesel ribbit transaxle for it's double OD's and a 13B rotary.

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PostPosted: October 22, 2016, 9:24 am 
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ntsqd wrote:
Entirely different application, but I had thought to use a FWD engine/trans combo installed longitudinally. Then an early Z car rear diff (R180 or R200) at each end. The compound reduction would require something that rev'd along with the tallest diff ratios that could be found. My thought was a diesel ribbit transaxle for it's double OD's and a 13B rotary.


I've been looking at Nissan diffs as well. The new Skyline is like a 2.7 or 2.9 FD. Even with a tall FD on the transaxle, that could still leave really short gearing...but not sure where you'd get a matching rear diff.

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PostPosted: October 22, 2016, 10:38 am 
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There's an identical thread elsewhere here - it's not a new problem.

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PostPosted: October 26, 2016, 1:13 pm 
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ntsqd wrote:
Entirely different application, but I had thought to use a FWD engine/trans combo installed longitudinally. ... The compound reduction would require something that rev'd along with the tallest diff ratios that could be found.


If you can live with an automatic, the GM 4T60 is your huckleberry: just weld up the planetary gears in the last output stage and you eliminate the final drive reduction. Output is 1:1, just like a regular longitudinal transmission.

The 4T60, 4T80, and related transmissions have the "corporate V6" pattern, and will accept most GM fours, (including the Quad 4) 60 degree V6s (including the Chevy 3.4 DOHC) and the 90 degree Buick 3800 supercharged, and a couple versions of the LS series V8s that were used in transverse applications. Some Isuzu and Honda engines also share the same bolt pattern.

Turned longitudinally, the output shaft centerline is nine inches from the crank centerline if I remember right. A slight engine and shaft offset would probably be desirable. The 4T60 uses a HyVo chain between the crankshaft and transmission; there are various ratios available, and many of them can be flipped giving a range of underdrive/overdrive options.

I had planned on using one with a turbo Buick V6, but my wife wanted to use the driveline out of her old Geo, and I have a pile of Geo spares, so Geo it is...


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