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 Post subject: Living with a BEC
PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2009 10:29 pm 
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Quick reality check...I know alot of folks are making BECs for the track, but are there folks out there living with these cars as street machines? Do they work out for commuting to work on occasion?

I have no plans to take this car on the track, so am I making any kind of mistake going with an R1 engine over a regular car engine? Are there things I should be aware of that aren't obvious?


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 Post subject: Re: Living with a BEC
PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2009 11:03 pm 
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Your mistake is not wanting to take the car to the track :wink: !

For street use a car engine makes more sense, but than again, this car isn't about making sense, it's a 7 for god sake not a Camry.
Plenty of folks over on the UK forum use their cars for street driving where BEC builds are much more common.

Have you ever tried driving at the track?
The go-fast crack pipe is as much fun as you can have with your pants on.

Moti

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 Post subject: Re: Living with a BEC
PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2009 11:50 pm 
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CodeStar wrote:
Quick reality check...I know alot of folks are making BECs for the track, but are there folks out there living with these cars as street machines? Do they work out for commuting to work on occasion?

Sure, but it's sort of like driving a race car on the street. The main problem in areas with lots of traffic is that the car is so low that people tend to not remember it's there. I have an antenna on mine with a bright read streamer on the top end.

I have no plans to take this car on the track, so am I making any kind of mistake going with an R1 engine over a regular car engine? Are there things I should be aware of that aren't obvious?
I have a "Driving impressions of Locouki" article on my website you might want to read.

Several things that I would do differently if I were to build another BEC;
1. Get the clutch pedal to have more movement (9:1 ratio isn't quite enough).
2. Make the throttle response progressive so that it takes approximately 3/4" of pedal motion to get the engine off idle.
3. Make sure and use a LSD rear end with ~3.1:1 ratio. I have the LSD but the wrong ratio.
These are all on my "things to do list".

Other than those things, a BEC is just a high revving, way to much power to weight ratio, every day run of the mill race car. :lol:

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Completed building GSXR1000 CMC7, "Locouki"
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 Post subject: Re: Living with a BEC
PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2009 12:33 am 
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WOW! Awesome writeup. What can I say....sold.

Thanks for taking the time to do that.


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 Post subject: Re: Living with a BEC
PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2009 1:07 am 
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Ok I'll bite...

olrowdy_01 wrote:
I have a "Driving impressions of Locouki" article on my website you might want to read.

Several things that I would do differently if I were to build another BEC;
1. Get the clutch pedal to have more movement (9:1 ratio isn't quite enough).
2. Make the throttle response progressive so that it takes approximately 3/4" of pedal motion to get the engine off idle.
3. Make sure and use a LSD rear end with ~3.1:1 ratio. I have the LSD but the wrong ratio.
These are all on my "things to do list".

Other than those things, a BEC is just a high revving, way to much power to weight ratio, every day run of the mill race car. :lol:


1) Are you using a cabled clutch or a hydraulic one? Did you go with heavier clutch springs to help the feel or kep the stock ones?
3) What ratio are you using now? I've got a 4.11 and I think I need to find a new ring and pinion combination to get something workable.

Thanks,
Mike

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 Post subject: Re: Living with a BEC
PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2009 1:09 am 
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Mike - what diff are you using?

Moti

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 Post subject: Re: Living with a BEC
PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2009 9:53 am 
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Moti,

I'm using an S2000 diff. The ring and pinions are supposed to be interchangable with Miata stuff.

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 Post subject: Re: Living with a BEC
PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2009 2:46 pm 
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Unless you're in it too deep at this point, consider switching to the Thunderbird diff, it's lighter, easy to package and pretty cheap, you'll most likely come ahead if you sell your S2k parts.

Moti

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www.BlackbirdFabworx.com - quality performance fabrication work, NASA / SCCA road racing, Redline time attack, Miata specialist, Honda, Subaru, Mitsubishi, Caterham, Locost and YOUR car!


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 Post subject: Re: Living with a BEC
PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2009 3:10 pm 
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driving a BEC on the street is still a dream of mine, but day by day its becoming a reality. Moti is right though about tracks, they are so much fun. Even if it is just a street car you have to try a track at least once. My car is going to be mainly for the street, but by all means i plan to get it on the track when i can.

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 Post subject: Re: Living with a BEC
PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2009 3:46 pm 
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Mike Basden wrote:
Ok I'll bite...

olrowdy_01 wrote:
I have a "Driving impressions of Locouki" article on my website you might want to read.

Several things that I would do differently if I were to build another BEC;
1. Get the clutch pedal to have more movement (9:1 ratio isn't quite enough).
2. Make the throttle response progressive so that it takes approximately 3/4" of pedal motion to get the engine off idle.
3. Make sure and use a LSD rear end with ~3.1:1 ratio. I have the LSD but the wrong ratio.
These are all on my "things to do list".

Other than those things, a BEC is just a high revving, way to much power to weight ratio, every day run of the mill race car. :lol:


1) Are you using a cabled clutch or a hydraulic one? Did you go with heavier clutch springs to help the feel or kep the stock ones?

I'm using a hydraulic clutch system from a Mazda. The master and slave are both 5/8" diameter. So I have 1:1 ratio there. The original owner put Barnett clutch springs in it. But I'm not sure that the feel would be noticeable to my foot though. The main problem is that it takes so little pedal motion to engage the clutch that you need a pretty low pedal ratio to give you more movement to modulate the release point. Once you're moving everything is fine.

After ripping up a bunch of '40 Ford xmissions etc I finally figured out that if I took off easy and THEN floor it that parts last longer. :oops:


3) What ratio are you using now? I've got a 4.11 and I think I need to find a new ring and pinion combination to get something workable.

My stock ratio is 3.933:1 (1983 GSL). I've been looking at the info on various rear ends (ratio, LSD yes/no, and width) for some time and right now I think a '79-'93 stick shift, 4 cylinder Mustang (7-1/2") might work. They had two optional gear ratios (3.08 & 3.27) that would be OK. Of course finding a car with those gears is something else. Most of them came with autos (3.73). I haven't been able to measure the WMS distance yet as the car in the junk yard that I'm interested in looking at has another car sitting on top of it! :ack:

Thanks,
Mike

Quote:
I'm using an S2000 diff. The ring and pinions are supposed to be interchangable with Miata stuff.
I'd measure your gears and whatever ones you are thinking of putting in -before- I put any cash down. There's a lot of misinformation out on the web. Ask all of us that bought B2000 gears to put into a RX-7 or Miata axles ..............

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"My junk is organized. At least is was when I put it wherever it is." -olrowdy
Completed building GSXR1000 CMC7, "Locouki"
http://dmr-architect.com/~locouki/


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 Post subject: Re: Living with a BEC
PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2009 4:43 pm 
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Blackbird wrote:
Unless you're in it too deep at this point, consider switching to the Thunderbird diff, it's lighter, easy to package and pretty cheap, you'll most likely come ahead if you sell your S2k parts.

Moti


Moti,

I'd love to ditch the S2K parts. They're way too heavy. The biggest issue I'd have doing so is wheels and tires. I already bought some so if I can find spindles and a diff that will work with some 5x114 I'd be up for it.

I'm on my iPhone and can't recall what spindles you chose but I think it's a 4x100 set up(?).

Thanks,
Mike

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 Post subject: Re: Living with a BEC
PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2009 6:14 pm 
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I'm using miata uprights / hubs (4x100).
The T-bird axles need to be modified to work with them but it's doable, I know that it is at least with the miata hubs.

Moti

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 Post subject: Re: Living with a BEC
PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 8:38 pm 
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olrowdy_01 wrote:
right now I think a '79-'93 stick shift, 4 cylinder Mustang (7-1/2") might work. They had two optional gear ratios (3.08 & 3.27) that would be OK. Of course finding a car with those gears is something else. Most of them came with autos (3.73). I haven't been able to measure the WMS distance yet as the car in the junk yard that I'm interested in looking at has another car sitting on top of it! :ack:


Just a note, many 2WD Rangers and some Broncos and Aerostars had 7.5" rears in them. Aerostars and many Broncos and very few Rangers had Discs too.
Also, Jegs and Richmond Gear both make 7.5" R&P sets : http://www.richmondgear.com/07pdfs/RG6.pdf 3.45 to 5.13 ratios, so a bit off of what your looking for though.


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 Post subject: Re: Living with a BEC
PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 8:54 pm 
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Olrowdy_01,

What size wheel and tire package are you using?

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 Post subject: Re: Living with a BEC
PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 10:00 pm 
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Mike Basden wrote:
Olrowdy_01,

What size wheel and tire package are you using?

The rims are: Kosei "K-1 Racing", 15" x 7" width
Tires are: Kumho 205/50ZR15

_________________
"My junk is organized. At least is was when I put it wherever it is." -olrowdy
Completed building GSXR1000 CMC7, "Locouki"
http://dmr-architect.com/~locouki/


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